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this is the saucer life exploring the

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history and lore of flying saucers i'm

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aaron gullias

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the saucer life is a podcast in which we

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explore concepts events or people from

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the world of flying saucers no guests no

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preconceptions no snark no belief no

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debunking and that was the introduction

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the first introduction with any sort of

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music or narrative uh really from our

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second episode about al bender complete

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with the word debunking being being cut

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off there at uh there at the end to be

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honest until i went back and looked at

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that or tried to find it i had no idea

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how i used to start these episodes

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that's because it's been five years of

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the saucer life almost to the day which

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is just

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mind-boggling

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i'm not sure i expected the saucer life

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to go five months and five years is just

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an implausibly long time for a flying

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saucer podcast that avoids all of the

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major flying saucer stories

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avoids anything that happened after

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about the year 2000 features just one

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person mostly

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talking

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and has a focus on historical documents

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it's an implausibly long time for this

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kind of show to run

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but

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here we are

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five years later and if i do the math

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right and i remember what the numbers

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were from our old hosting site before we

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moved to pinecast which i recommend if

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you need a podcast host pinecast is

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great uh i think we are at

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about

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000 downloads since we started which you

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know there are lots of shows get that i

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don't know every week probably but i

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don't know i like it i'll be

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i don't really care um but it's nice to

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sort of keep track of those kinds of

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statistics so thank you for five years

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of listening thank you especially for

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those of you who have supported chiso

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media over on the patreon for the last

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seven

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eight months or so since the beginning

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of the year i appreciate that very much

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samantha my co-host over at great lakes

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lore appreciates that

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as well the saucer wife appreciates it

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because now i'm not

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necessarily begging money for flying

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saucer books like i have been known to

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do in the past

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so

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for it and then i realized

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and this sounds really cheesy i thought

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maybe i'd make it kind of a celebration

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of you folks out there listening so i

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put up a survey and i i solicited things

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on social media i wanted people to tell

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me their favorite topics that we've

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covered topics that they want me to

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cover in the future and then any

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questions they had for me i would do my

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best to answer them and i got an

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astounding response i'm not gonna say an

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overwhelming response i think it's it's

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whelming it's solidly in the the

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whelming category and um i want to thank

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those of those people who left names on

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the survey there were a lot more

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anonymous people than this but

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thanks goes out to julian zee david

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southwell eduard sir topham hatt doc

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pinko fred g adam f sarah l heather jim

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r red pill junkie bumpy lumps hiram rat

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skillet

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brian rosenquist ben baird laura josh

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from gallipoli von weikert gabriel mckee

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stephen fowler uh blackwolf john oates

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off twitter and the patreon andy social

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jim davis and like i said a bunch of

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other anonymous people so

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rather than try to keep people's names

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with the things they contributed i just

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thought i would i would credit those

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people who wanted who had a name to put

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in the credit slot or who uh who said

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something on twitter and oh and nate

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thomas as well uh forgot nate thomas

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almost because his name was in a

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different part of my file so in so there

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those are the people who helped

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contribute there were like i said many

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others uh unnamed but we remember them

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in our hearts so before we dive in to um

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your comments and uh requests and

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questions uh i just just some saucer

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life trivia here for those who might be

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interested because i think this is

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interesting stump sometimes i always

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sort of wonder

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what is our most downloaded

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episode and to be fair this is this is

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just

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basically because we've we switched

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hosts this is just the last gosh i think

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three years out of the five but as of

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right now

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our most downloaded episode is our

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episode on the nine

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followed closely by our follow-up

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episode on the stargate conspiracy which

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just

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really confuses me because those two

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knocked out of knocked out of first

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place the one that had been there

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forever which was our maury island

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episode and the janos people come in

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fourth so it's and then fifth just round

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up the fifth place who are the

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controllers so those are the the five

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most

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people could download them and hate them

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which would make them much downloaded

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but unpopular i i will say i was not

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thrilled with the 9 or the stargate

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conspiracy just from my perspective as

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somebody making the podcasts i'm always

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a little

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concerned when we've got these topics

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that are

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deeply deeply intricate and um and and

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also fairly well known that uh you know

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18 000 people coming out of the woodwork

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to tell me what i did wrong uh but no

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i'm

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surprised and a little happy to see that

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other other saucer life trivia i don't

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know i don't have a least popular

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episode um just because the way the

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stats are tracked um

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it it just doesn't work to sort of to

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sort of find that but um

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i will say that uh gosh least favorite

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episode of mine to

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work on

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gosh i've i've got to say probably

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probably the philadelphia experiment my

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montauk project trilogy was the my least

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favorite to uh to work on just because

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again giant intricate topic that

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required me to have

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conspiracy theorist style

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yarn boards and whiteboards and lots of

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drawings and that's just trying to

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figure out where al bilik's soul is at

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at any given time

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my favorite episode before we get into

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other people's favorite episodes um my

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favorite episode that i did was probably

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the orpheo angelucci episode that that

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one was

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um

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yeah all right so that's just sort of my

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thoughts about actually my favorite

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topics just sort of the question that i

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asked all of you so let's get to it

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let's get to people's favorite topics or

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at least the people who responded to my

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my summons for attention and isn't

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asking for any feedback when you're

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doing a podcast some sort of summons for

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attention isn't doing a podcast a

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summons for attention in some ways

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all right your favorite topics i've

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tried to

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sort of eliminate uh duplicates and

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overlap here but uh

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let's take a look

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here's one almost impossible to pick out

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but the bill cooper episode made me very

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happy during a week so it will

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always have a special place in my heart

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oh good i'm you know there's some times

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where where i just i don't know exactly

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what i'm doing the show but if it makes

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people

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feel better when they're having a down

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time like some things i've listened to

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over the years have then then that's all

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i'm i'm really kind of worried about and

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and

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bill cooper

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uh this person goes on to say every

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episode of the zine scene is also

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fantastic particularly the ones in which

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you do a coral lorenzen voice i had

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forgotten until i saw this that i

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actually have a coral lorenzen voice and

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i need to go back and listen to some of

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those because i can't remember exactly

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what my coral laurens and voice is um

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speaking of the zine scene ones lots of

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um

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lots of lots of praise for the zen scene

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episodes which makes me happy because

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those are

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some of my favorite to do just because

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it's so fun to immerse oneself in in a

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time period in that in that way and

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magazine articles are much more

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compatible with my attention span than

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than books sometimes but yeah i need to

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go back and listen to my coral laurens

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and voice because i think there is going

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to be some apro stuff coming up in in

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the future uh also some flying saucer

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review stuff from britain and their

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editor gordon creighton and i know i had

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a gordon creighton voice and i was

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trying to remember what that was i'm

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gonna have to go back and uh and review

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that i i think it's sort of a a pompous

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not british but but sort of mid-atlantic

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style uh style accents so i i think i'm

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going to have to review not not accents

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but just sort of tonality um people like

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the the morse k jessup episodes and

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william dudley pelly um good i'm glad

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i'm glad people enjoyed william dudley

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pelly that one was difficult to to find

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a good angle on that didn't turn into a

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giant

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sort of history lesson about

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fascism in the 30s and kept some flying

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saucers in there

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mystery airships was popular the 90s ufo

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recap was popular there's gonna be some

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more 90s stuff coming up um in the very

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very near future

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one respondent said honestly my

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favorites are the holiday episodes they

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are really fun and perfectly crafted for

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the crowd that listens to them already

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looking forward to listening to the next

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one while wrapping christmas presents

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thank you very much i have no idea what

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the

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2022

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saucer life holiday special is going to

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be um

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no idea i need to sort of think of that

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because sometimes they have production

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requirements that go beyond

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beyond what we normally do here on the

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show there were a couple of mentions of

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the read these books episodes including

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read these books read these other books

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and read these books now i think i need

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to come up with another variation on

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that

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the problem with the read these books

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segments

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is that

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so often i'm reading so many books for

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the actual episodes that reading extra

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books

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for an additional epis actually that is

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a terrible excuse and doesn't make any

279
00:10:59,350 --> 00:10:56,240
sense yes more uh read these books

280
00:11:01,750 --> 00:10:59,360
episodes coming uh coming up uh episodes

281
00:11:03,829 --> 00:11:01,760
about golden age contactees and there

282
00:11:06,710 --> 00:11:03,839
were a bunch of different contact d

283
00:11:08,230 --> 00:11:06,720
responses sort of gathered them here um

284
00:11:09,829 --> 00:11:08,240
elaborate contact these stories that

285
00:11:12,790 --> 00:11:09,839
read like science fiction such as the

286
00:11:14,150 --> 00:11:12,800
janos people contact with coldest

287
00:11:16,310 --> 00:11:14,160
other people like the janos people

288
00:11:18,069 --> 00:11:16,320
saying a boring english family have a

289
00:11:20,310 --> 00:11:18,079
sighting that ends up as a novel about

290
00:11:24,389 --> 00:11:20,320
middle class white people heaven that is

291
00:11:27,670 --> 00:11:24,399
the best uh the best tagline for that um

292
00:11:30,630 --> 00:11:27,680
for that uh i can possibly

293
00:11:33,110 --> 00:11:30,640
come up with saucer felons and con men

294
00:11:35,430 --> 00:11:33,120
and grifters and hoaxers uh lights

295
00:11:38,069 --> 00:11:35,440
camera reinhold about our our friend

296
00:11:39,350 --> 00:11:38,079
reinhold schmidt came up a few times

297
00:11:41,829 --> 00:11:39,360
there's there's gonna be uh there's

298
00:11:43,509 --> 00:11:41,839
gonna be some hoaxers or i'm sorry

299
00:11:47,110 --> 00:11:43,519
there's going to be some suspected

300
00:11:50,069 --> 00:11:47,120
hoaxers in our uh in our near future so

301
00:11:51,269 --> 00:11:50,079
hopefully people will be on board with

302
00:11:53,350 --> 00:11:51,279
that

303
00:11:54,790 --> 00:11:53,360
road trips to sites of famous encounters

304
00:11:56,949 --> 00:11:54,800
the kelly hopkinsville encounter

305
00:11:58,949 --> 00:11:56,959
terrified me as a youngster this person

306
00:12:00,470 --> 00:11:58,959
says i was convinced something like that

307
00:12:02,790 --> 00:12:00,480
could happen at our house in suburban

308
00:12:03,910 --> 00:12:02,800
1970s canada listening to your road trip

309
00:12:05,829 --> 00:12:03,920
adventure down there was pretty

310
00:12:07,670 --> 00:12:05,839
therapeutic it diffused some of the

311
00:12:09,350 --> 00:12:07,680
trauma in my childhood imagining of it

312
00:12:12,069 --> 00:12:09,360
oh good um

313
00:12:13,030 --> 00:12:12,079
i'm a good i'm i'm happy to hear that

314
00:12:17,670 --> 00:12:13,040
that

315
00:12:19,590 --> 00:12:17,680
they conclude by saying some october 9th

316
00:12:21,990 --> 00:12:19,600
you should go fish off that pier on the

317
00:12:25,190 --> 00:12:22,000
pascagoula river oh that would be

318
00:12:27,590 --> 00:12:25,200
outstanding um i did not get a

319
00:12:29,750 --> 00:12:27,600
paranormal road trip in

320
00:12:32,389 --> 00:12:29,760
this year or a history road trip like i

321
00:12:33,990 --> 00:12:32,399
usually do um things have been very busy

322
00:12:37,430 --> 00:12:34,000
but also

323
00:12:39,910 --> 00:12:37,440
gas prices were a little high and

324
00:12:41,750 --> 00:12:39,920
we had other trips to take that uh sort

325
00:12:43,190 --> 00:12:41,760
of that gas money ended up being

326
00:12:45,430 --> 00:12:43,200
earmarked for i will tell you that

327
00:12:47,910 --> 00:12:45,440
simpson jahan over the third and i have

328
00:12:50,870 --> 00:12:47,920
strongly considered some way to go out

329
00:12:53,030 --> 00:12:50,880
to mount shasta at some point but since

330
00:12:55,590 --> 00:12:53,040
um we both live a long way from mount

331
00:12:57,269 --> 00:12:55,600
shasta that might be a long-term a

332
00:13:00,069 --> 00:12:57,279
long-term project

333
00:13:02,069 --> 00:13:00,079
um one person liked encount um

334
00:13:03,990 --> 00:13:02,079
bender and the men in black the bender

335
00:13:06,230 --> 00:13:04,000
episode that was that was a good one

336
00:13:07,590 --> 00:13:06,240
it's the bender one is another one where

337
00:13:09,590 --> 00:13:07,600
we're not another one i haven't

338
00:13:10,790 --> 00:13:09,600
mentioned any but the bender episode is

339
00:13:12,069 --> 00:13:10,800
an episode

340
00:13:13,430 --> 00:13:12,079
where

341
00:13:14,790 --> 00:13:13,440
there's part of me

342
00:13:16,790 --> 00:13:14,800
is sort of

343
00:13:18,389 --> 00:13:16,800
thinking it would be nice to go back and

344
00:13:21,590 --> 00:13:18,399
and redo that

345
00:13:23,269 --> 00:13:21,600
to a degree or or do a bend or two

346
00:13:25,910 --> 00:13:23,279
electric boogaloo sort of thing because

347
00:13:28,230 --> 00:13:25,920
it was the second episode i did and and

348
00:13:30,550 --> 00:13:28,240
so i i've i've learned a lot

349
00:13:32,710 --> 00:13:30,560
um since then i look at the bender

350
00:13:34,710 --> 00:13:32,720
episode and i'm i'm horrified how short

351
00:13:37,190 --> 00:13:34,720
it is uh they also liked big feet from

352
00:13:39,509 --> 00:13:37,200
space yes space bigfoot is always fun

353
00:13:41,829 --> 00:13:39,519
maury island um king david's daughter

354
00:13:43,829 --> 00:13:41,839
and the lizard people sheri shriner lots

355
00:13:47,189 --> 00:13:43,839
of fans of the sherry shriner episodes

356
00:13:48,949 --> 00:13:47,199
and the the disclosure um episode they

357
00:13:52,310 --> 00:13:48,959
picked one episode from each year well

358
00:13:54,389 --> 00:13:52,320
that was that was a good way to do it um

359
00:13:57,269 --> 00:13:54,399
people some people one person liked the

360
00:13:59,430 --> 00:13:57,279
umo episode um

361
00:14:01,590 --> 00:13:59,440
another person said so tough to pick the

362
00:14:03,430 --> 00:14:01,600
mothman series was particularly good and

363
00:14:04,870 --> 00:14:03,440
my predilections lead me to pick the

364
00:14:05,910 --> 00:14:04,880
silver bridge episode as the best of

365
00:14:08,069 --> 00:14:05,920
them

366
00:14:09,509 --> 00:14:08,079
i agree i also love a good swindle so

367
00:14:11,829 --> 00:14:09,519
the reinhold schmidt and maury island

368
00:14:13,430 --> 00:14:11,839
ones are up there too

369
00:14:16,069 --> 00:14:13,440
um

370
00:14:18,949 --> 00:14:16,079
yes uh maury island was was fun maury

371
00:14:21,590 --> 00:14:18,959
island got uh got pretty in depth uh and

372
00:14:22,230 --> 00:14:21,600
and i i did like the mothman i liked how

373
00:14:27,269 --> 00:14:22,240
i

374
00:14:28,790 --> 00:14:27,279
not to toot my own horn but to toot um

375
00:14:31,269 --> 00:14:28,800
i liked

376
00:14:34,870 --> 00:14:31,279
i i think i did a good job with that

377
00:14:35,990 --> 00:14:34,880
mothman series i i think my approach

378
00:14:40,550 --> 00:14:36,000
of

379
00:14:43,590 --> 00:14:40,560
from kiehl's heels

380
00:14:45,430 --> 00:14:43,600
notes from the time as opposed to to

381
00:14:47,990 --> 00:14:45,440
just the mothman prophecies and

382
00:14:49,350 --> 00:14:48,000
newspapers and then silverbridge i think

383
00:14:51,670 --> 00:14:49,360
that was

384
00:14:54,550 --> 00:14:51,680
i liked how i did that i was actually

385
00:14:57,350 --> 00:14:54,560
kind of kind of happy that i did that

386
00:14:58,949 --> 00:14:57,360
here's a comment the recent pk man

387
00:15:00,389 --> 00:14:58,959
episode was great and then there's the

388
00:15:02,310 --> 00:15:00,399
allende episode where he got me

389
00:15:03,509 --> 00:15:02,320
teary-eyed when discussing pj dowers

390
00:15:08,470 --> 00:15:03,519
book

391
00:15:10,069 --> 00:15:08,480
i was not expecting that i got a couple

392
00:15:13,189 --> 00:15:10,079
tip-offs that i needed to get my hands

393
00:15:15,670 --> 00:15:13,199
on it and i'm really glad

394
00:15:17,310 --> 00:15:15,680
i took the risk in sending my money off

395
00:15:19,430 --> 00:15:17,320
to this very

396
00:15:22,470 --> 00:15:19,440
1998 looking

397
00:15:23,670 --> 00:15:22,480
website because it it presented an angle

398
00:15:25,269 --> 00:15:23,680
that

399
00:15:26,629 --> 00:15:25,279
i don't think i could have gotten

400
00:15:28,150 --> 00:15:26,639
on that topic

401
00:15:30,550 --> 00:15:28,160
any other way

402
00:15:31,829 --> 00:15:30,560
me and you and a dog named bo

403
00:15:33,829 --> 00:15:31,839
about um

404
00:15:36,710 --> 00:15:33,839
buck nelson great story and i love the

405
00:15:38,949 --> 00:15:36,720
reference to am gold legend lobo yes

406
00:15:40,389 --> 00:15:38,959
indeed uh the episodes with grey barker

407
00:15:42,230 --> 00:15:40,399
this person says are some of my

408
00:15:44,629 --> 00:15:42,240
favorites he seemed to be such an

409
00:15:46,310 --> 00:15:44,639
interesting guy kind of a con artist but

410
00:15:49,430 --> 00:15:46,320
still likable and not completely

411
00:15:52,949 --> 00:15:51,350
more another person says more genres

412
00:15:54,629 --> 00:15:52,959
than episodes for learning about

413
00:15:56,069 --> 00:15:54,639
something new that i just can't be

414
00:15:59,110 --> 00:15:56,079
bothered to read the books the one

415
00:16:00,710 --> 00:15:59,120
contact dn1 episode episodes are really

416
00:16:02,310 --> 00:16:00,720
great my personal faves are all

417
00:16:04,470 --> 00:16:02,320
involving the nexus of the intelligence

418
00:16:06,389 --> 00:16:04,480
military community and the ufo community

419
00:16:08,710 --> 00:16:06,399
or the nexus of the ufo community and

420
00:16:11,670 --> 00:16:08,720
right wing and fascist politics but you

421
00:16:14,389 --> 00:16:11,680
can never go wrong with humanoids

422
00:16:17,030 --> 00:16:14,399
no you can't the humanoids are are just

423
00:16:18,470 --> 00:16:17,040
the perfect um oh this will be fun this

424
00:16:20,389 --> 00:16:18,480
will be a nice

425
00:16:22,310 --> 00:16:20,399
refreshing palette cleanser after the

426
00:16:25,509 --> 00:16:22,320
nexus of the ufo community and

427
00:16:28,069 --> 00:16:25,519
right-wing and fascist politics um

428
00:16:30,790 --> 00:16:28,079
oh and uh one person said

429
00:16:31,990 --> 00:16:30,800
favorite uh episode or topic the one i'm

430
00:16:35,110 --> 00:16:32,000
listening to

431
00:16:36,470 --> 00:16:35,120
well thank you that is

432
00:16:38,150 --> 00:16:36,480
that uh

433
00:16:39,350 --> 00:16:38,160
that's very convenient for me to say

434
00:16:41,110 --> 00:16:39,360
well hey it's the one you're listening

435
00:16:42,870 --> 00:16:41,120
to it must be

436
00:16:44,550 --> 00:16:42,880
a good one thank you for that insight it

437
00:16:46,949 --> 00:16:44,560
gives me some idea

438
00:16:48,230 --> 00:16:46,959
a bit of um of what's been good and

439
00:16:50,470 --> 00:16:48,240
what's been

440
00:16:53,269 --> 00:16:50,480
not bad but maybe

441
00:16:55,590 --> 00:16:53,279
less uh less impactful and what i think

442
00:16:57,189 --> 00:16:55,600
is is interesting and maybe nobody else

443
00:16:59,269 --> 00:16:57,199
does and i do acknowledge that this

444
00:17:01,749 --> 00:16:59,279
entire episode is is a little

445
00:17:03,269 --> 00:17:01,759
self-indulgent hey let's let me talk

446
00:17:05,189 --> 00:17:03,279
about myself and what people say about

447
00:17:07,510 --> 00:17:05,199
me for a while but

448
00:17:09,750 --> 00:17:07,520
it's my show so what i think is

449
00:17:11,429 --> 00:17:09,760
interesting is the episodes that seem to

450
00:17:14,949 --> 00:17:11,439
have had the

451
00:17:17,590 --> 00:17:14,959
biggest impact on people that responded

452
00:17:19,270 --> 00:17:17,600
are the episodes that had the biggest

453
00:17:21,909 --> 00:17:19,280
impact on me

454
00:17:24,949 --> 00:17:21,919
making them so

455
00:17:27,189 --> 00:17:24,959
my suspicion is that it's not

456
00:17:30,230 --> 00:17:27,199
necessarily my present just my

457
00:17:32,710 --> 00:17:30,240
presentation of these topics but also

458
00:17:33,510 --> 00:17:32,720
the topics themselves have something in

459
00:17:36,630 --> 00:17:33,520
them

460
00:17:37,750 --> 00:17:36,640
that that resonates with people to a

461
00:17:39,990 --> 00:17:37,760
degree

462
00:17:41,590 --> 00:17:40,000
even the janus people with their uh

463
00:17:42,390 --> 00:17:41,600
their their grill

464
00:17:44,470 --> 00:17:42,400
by

465
00:17:46,430 --> 00:17:44,480
the lake but thank you for those

466
00:17:50,870 --> 00:17:46,440
insights

467
00:17:55,350 --> 00:17:53,430
all right before we get into the midway

468
00:17:56,549 --> 00:17:55,360
break here um

469
00:17:58,070 --> 00:17:56,559
actually i have no idea where the midway

470
00:18:00,549 --> 00:17:58,080
is going to be but before we get into

471
00:18:01,590 --> 00:18:00,559
our little sort of middle break

472
00:18:02,950 --> 00:18:01,600
um

473
00:18:04,789 --> 00:18:02,960
i just want to talk to you about what's

474
00:18:09,029 --> 00:18:04,799
coming in the future about the future of

475
00:18:12,789 --> 00:18:09,039
the show not in an anonymous ominous way

476
00:18:14,630 --> 00:18:12,799
don't worry no not not in anonymous um

477
00:18:16,470 --> 00:18:14,640
not in a bad way or a threatening way

478
00:18:18,789 --> 00:18:16,480
but just some things that are coming

479
00:18:20,310 --> 00:18:18,799
some changes some ideas i've had uh one

480
00:18:21,990 --> 00:18:20,320
thing you'll be seeing

481
00:18:22,789 --> 00:18:22,000
um

482
00:18:27,270 --> 00:18:22,799
not

483
00:18:28,390 --> 00:18:27,280
more stories from outside the united

484
00:18:29,990 --> 00:18:28,400
states

485
00:18:31,990 --> 00:18:30,000
as we're going to see in the requested

486
00:18:33,990 --> 00:18:32,000
topics that comes up a bit so more

487
00:18:34,950 --> 00:18:34,000
stories from outside the united states

488
00:18:37,510 --> 00:18:34,960
um

489
00:18:39,190 --> 00:18:37,520
we're we're going to also

490
00:18:42,390 --> 00:18:39,200
be um

491
00:18:44,950 --> 00:18:42,400
we using the royal we i'm going to be

492
00:18:46,950 --> 00:18:44,960
ending the standalone listener feedback

493
00:18:48,549 --> 00:18:46,960
segments on off weeks i'm not saying

494
00:18:52,150 --> 00:18:48,559
there won't be occasional off-week

495
00:18:55,750 --> 00:18:52,160
things of some sort if i have reason to

496
00:18:56,630 --> 00:18:55,760
but what i've found is that

497
00:18:58,630 --> 00:18:56,640
the

498
00:19:00,630 --> 00:18:58,640
production and uploading and

499
00:19:02,310 --> 00:19:00,640
and doing a little graphic and and

500
00:19:03,830 --> 00:19:02,320
getting everything ready for those

501
00:19:05,909 --> 00:19:03,840
off-week segments it takes me about

502
00:19:07,350 --> 00:19:05,919
three times as long to do all that as it

503
00:19:10,549 --> 00:19:07,360
takes to actually

504
00:19:12,150 --> 00:19:10,559
listen to the segment and um it's

505
00:19:13,110 --> 00:19:12,160
something i started

506
00:19:15,270 --> 00:19:13,120
during

507
00:19:17,830 --> 00:19:15,280
sort of the 2020

508
00:19:19,990 --> 00:19:17,840
everything has changed period of time

509
00:19:22,789 --> 00:19:20,000
and things are getting back to a a

510
00:19:24,950 --> 00:19:22,799
busier schedule than i had before so i

511
00:19:26,310 --> 00:19:24,960
will still be responding to all of your

512
00:19:28,310 --> 00:19:26,320
questions and comments i'll just be

513
00:19:31,270 --> 00:19:28,320
doing during doing it during the middle

514
00:19:34,470 --> 00:19:31,280
break segment of the next regular

515
00:19:35,990 --> 00:19:34,480
episode so um going to be doing that uh

516
00:19:37,430 --> 00:19:36,000
just the the

517
00:19:38,950 --> 00:19:37,440
and also the disparity in download

518
00:19:41,190 --> 00:19:38,960
numbers between the regular episodes and

519
00:19:42,630 --> 00:19:41,200
listener feedback episodes yeah i think

520
00:19:45,590 --> 00:19:42,640
it's fine i don't think people are going

521
00:19:48,070 --> 00:19:45,600
to be too angry um i i hope you're not

522
00:19:50,070 --> 00:19:48,080
but uh it was just getting to be

523
00:19:51,669 --> 00:19:50,080
a bit too quick of turnaround time from

524
00:19:53,350 --> 00:19:51,679
one episode to the feedback episode to

525
00:19:54,789 --> 00:19:53,360
the next episode and that's another

526
00:19:57,190 --> 00:19:54,799
reason is because i had to get these

527
00:19:59,270 --> 00:19:57,200
things ready so quickly because of my

528
00:20:00,710 --> 00:19:59,280
schedule that it didn't give people time

529
00:20:03,669 --> 00:20:00,720
enough to

530
00:20:06,230 --> 00:20:03,679
submit questions and comments so i think

531
00:20:07,430 --> 00:20:06,240
this will actually be a better system so

532
00:20:10,549 --> 00:20:07,440
that's one thing you'll be seeing in the

533
00:20:12,710 --> 00:20:10,559
future also i'm throwing around an idea

534
00:20:13,990 --> 00:20:12,720
of a type of episode that i am not

535
00:20:14,870 --> 00:20:14,000
entirely sure about so you might be

536
00:20:17,669 --> 00:20:14,880
hearing

537
00:20:18,830 --> 00:20:17,679
a a very bad episode at some point in

538
00:20:21,870 --> 00:20:18,840
the future

539
00:20:23,430 --> 00:20:21,880
um in history we call them

540
00:20:25,270 --> 00:20:23,440
counterfactuals

541
00:20:26,310 --> 00:20:25,280
what if something had gone

542
00:20:30,470 --> 00:20:26,320
differently

543
00:20:32,070 --> 00:20:30,480
how would ufo history be changed if um

544
00:20:35,350 --> 00:20:32,080
something happened

545
00:20:37,909 --> 00:20:35,360
that didn't happen in quote real life

546
00:20:39,750 --> 00:20:37,919
or um what what if what if something

547
00:20:41,110 --> 00:20:39,760
didn't happen that

548
00:20:43,110 --> 00:20:41,120
sort of

549
00:20:45,510 --> 00:20:43,120
had an impact in reality and and what if

550
00:20:47,510 --> 00:20:45,520
that thing didn't happen what if

551
00:20:49,590 --> 00:20:47,520
this person or that person decided not

552
00:20:51,669 --> 00:20:49,600
to get into ufos how would the history

553
00:20:53,510 --> 00:20:51,679
of ufology be changed how do we how

554
00:20:55,270 --> 00:20:53,520
would the way in which we think

555
00:20:56,630 --> 00:20:55,280
about flying saucers

556
00:20:58,149 --> 00:20:56,640
be a bit different

557
00:21:00,310 --> 00:20:58,159
i'm not sure how i'm going to do this

558
00:21:02,789 --> 00:21:00,320
but it's something i've toyed around

559
00:21:05,110 --> 00:21:02,799
with and so we might see a strand of

560
00:21:08,710 --> 00:21:05,120
episodes here and there that are sort of

561
00:21:10,710 --> 00:21:08,720
alternate ufo history um not

562
00:21:15,909 --> 00:21:10,720
not

563
00:21:18,870 --> 00:21:15,919
to go but it's an idea that i've had and

564
00:21:20,070 --> 00:21:18,880
as we get into the usual midway break

565
00:21:21,270 --> 00:21:20,080
stuff

566
00:21:24,390 --> 00:21:21,280
next time

567
00:21:25,750 --> 00:21:24,400
one of our most requested topics over

568
00:21:27,590 --> 00:21:25,760
the years

569
00:21:31,110 --> 00:21:27,600
is not going to be covered i was going

570
00:21:33,029 --> 00:21:31,120
to cover the gulf breeze six and then i

571
00:21:35,350 --> 00:21:33,039
i realized that maybe i should cover the

572
00:21:36,390 --> 00:21:35,360
gulf breeze sightings first and then i

573
00:21:38,390 --> 00:21:36,400
was like but i really want to cover the

574
00:21:40,710 --> 00:21:38,400
gulf breeze six instead of the sighting

575
00:21:42,310 --> 00:21:40,720
so i put a poll up on twitter and

576
00:21:44,390 --> 00:21:42,320
uh the twitter poll is resoundingly in

577
00:21:45,110 --> 00:21:44,400
favor of doing the gulf breeze sightings

578
00:21:47,830 --> 00:21:45,120
so

579
00:21:49,590 --> 00:21:47,840
next time the gulf breeze sightings ed

580
00:21:52,310 --> 00:21:49,600
walters

581
00:21:54,870 --> 00:21:52,320
ufos jim mosley shows up actually

582
00:21:58,669 --> 00:21:54,880
investigating ufos probably for the last

583
00:22:02,230 --> 00:21:58,679
time ever and is sort of engaged active

584
00:22:06,149 --> 00:22:02,240
investigatory way it's the late 80s

585
00:22:07,909 --> 00:22:06,159
mufon is running wild it is

586
00:22:10,230 --> 00:22:07,919
i was skeptical of the topic being

587
00:22:12,789 --> 00:22:10,240
interesting but oh my gosh it is

588
00:22:15,110 --> 00:22:12,799
interesting abductions hypnotic

589
00:22:17,270 --> 00:22:15,120
regression it's got everything and then

590
00:22:18,710 --> 00:22:17,280
the episode after that the gulf breeze

591
00:22:20,230 --> 00:22:18,720
six what does it have to do with the

592
00:22:21,029 --> 00:22:20,240
gulf breeze sightings

593
00:22:23,270 --> 00:22:21,039
they

594
00:22:26,230 --> 00:22:23,280
both involve the small town of gulf

595
00:22:29,110 --> 00:22:26,240
breeze florida in some way but that one

596
00:22:30,149 --> 00:22:29,120
gets really really wild as well so gulf

597
00:22:36,549 --> 00:22:30,159
breeze

598
00:22:38,390 --> 00:22:36,559
six

599
00:22:40,230 --> 00:22:38,400
if you like the saucer life and you want

600
00:22:42,149 --> 00:22:40,240
more you can support us in exchange for

601
00:22:43,750 --> 00:22:42,159
bonus content from both this show and

602
00:22:45,510 --> 00:22:43,760
our other chiso media podcast great

603
00:22:47,029 --> 00:22:45,520
likes lore you can check it out at

604
00:22:49,430 --> 00:22:47,039
patreon.com

605
00:22:52,070 --> 00:22:49,440
chiso media or via the link in the show

606
00:22:54,950 --> 00:22:52,080
notes you can google saucer life patreon

607
00:22:57,270 --> 00:22:54,960
you can go to chizomedia.com um all of

608
00:22:59,029 --> 00:22:57,280
these things will uh will get you there

609
00:23:01,190 --> 00:22:59,039
and we very much appreciate like i said

610
00:23:03,510 --> 00:23:01,200
all of you who have hopped onto the

611
00:23:05,510 --> 00:23:03,520
patreon there's some good conversation

612
00:23:07,750 --> 00:23:05,520
in the comments over there it's a good

613
00:23:10,230 --> 00:23:07,760
place to ask us questions where we um

614
00:23:11,750 --> 00:23:10,240
where we see them very very quickly uh

615
00:23:13,990 --> 00:23:11,760
you can check out past episodes of the

616
00:23:16,950 --> 00:23:14,000
saucer life on your favorite podcast app

617
00:23:19,270 --> 00:23:16,960
or at saucerlife.com as always we're on

618
00:23:21,510 --> 00:23:19,280
twitter and instagram at saucerlife and

619
00:23:23,510 --> 00:23:21,520
you can email us at thesaucerlife

620
00:23:25,909 --> 00:23:23,520
gmail.com

621
00:23:30,510 --> 00:23:25,919
you can contact us by post at chiso

622
00:23:33,990 --> 00:23:30,520
media po box 68 grand blank michigan

623
00:23:36,149 --> 00:23:34,000
48480 and one last sort of news and note

624
00:23:39,110 --> 00:23:36,159
update there's a link in the show notes

625
00:23:41,190 --> 00:23:39,120
but i put out the call last time for the

626
00:23:43,830 --> 00:23:41,200
catfish humanoid people to draw the

627
00:23:45,750 --> 00:23:43,840
catfish humanoid we had as of when i put

628
00:23:48,070 --> 00:23:45,760
the page together there's a link to

629
00:23:50,310 --> 00:23:48,080
eight people send in their

630
00:23:52,630 --> 00:23:50,320
interpretation their artist's impression

631
00:23:55,510 --> 00:23:52,640
of the catfish humanoid creature and

632
00:23:58,070 --> 00:23:55,520
they are all i mean i would never ever

633
00:23:58,950 --> 00:23:58,080
ever like rank or pick a favorite when

634
00:24:01,830 --> 00:23:58,960
people

635
00:24:05,110 --> 00:24:01,840
submit something like that for fun um i

636
00:24:07,350 --> 00:24:05,120
i like them all they all have um really

637
00:24:08,789 --> 00:24:07,360
interesting uh significant things about

638
00:24:09,830 --> 00:24:08,799
them so check out that link in the show

639
00:24:12,390 --> 00:24:09,840
notes you might have seen them here

640
00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:12,400
there on on social media but but check

641
00:24:24,070 --> 00:24:21,430
[Music]

642
00:24:26,390 --> 00:24:24,080
all right let's answer some

643
00:24:29,510 --> 00:24:26,400
ask me anything

644
00:24:31,750 --> 00:24:29,520
questions okay some of these um

645
00:24:33,190 --> 00:24:31,760
i i think i've got all of them i think i

646
00:24:35,269 --> 00:24:33,200
got all of them we'll do some questions

647
00:24:37,430 --> 00:24:35,279
and then we'll we'll talk about uh what

648
00:24:39,029 --> 00:24:37,440
you want to see in the future and how

649
00:24:40,549 --> 00:24:39,039
much likelihood there is of me covering

650
00:24:42,549 --> 00:24:40,559
that particular topic i'll try to be as

651
00:24:43,350 --> 00:24:42,559
honest as i can about that and i'll try

652
00:24:46,230 --> 00:24:43,360
to be

653
00:24:49,029 --> 00:24:46,240
as thorough as i can with these um ama

654
00:24:52,149 --> 00:24:49,039
questions i did not prep most of these

655
00:24:53,830 --> 00:24:52,159
so um i'll edit out any long awkward

656
00:24:55,590 --> 00:24:53,840
pauses first up how do you think your

657
00:24:58,230 --> 00:24:55,600
interest in saucers and perception of

658
00:24:59,750 --> 00:24:58,240
them has shaped your view of the world

659
00:25:00,630 --> 00:24:59,760
okay it's a multi-part question i'll

660
00:25:02,630 --> 00:25:00,640
take

661
00:25:04,710 --> 00:25:02,640
that that part first

662
00:25:06,870 --> 00:25:04,720
um

663
00:25:10,390 --> 00:25:06,880
i'm

664
00:25:12,310 --> 00:25:10,400
has but

665
00:25:14,310 --> 00:25:12,320
it hasn't

666
00:25:15,830 --> 00:25:14,320
there's no ufo story i've come across

667
00:25:17,269 --> 00:25:15,840
that has made me

668
00:25:21,350 --> 00:25:17,279
fundamentally

669
00:25:23,350 --> 00:25:21,360
readdress or reassess my worldview

670
00:25:25,909 --> 00:25:23,360
i i do think that

671
00:25:29,269 --> 00:25:25,919
uh some of the weirder more high

672
00:25:30,230 --> 00:25:29,279
strangest high strangeness oriented ufo

673
00:25:31,909 --> 00:25:30,240
stories

674
00:25:32,870 --> 00:25:31,919
have um

675
00:25:35,350 --> 00:25:32,880
have

676
00:25:37,990 --> 00:25:35,360
sort of sort of enhanced my interest in

677
00:25:40,789 --> 00:25:38,000
other areas of the paranormal

678
00:25:42,549 --> 00:25:40,799
and and my my sort of interest in an

679
00:25:43,590 --> 00:25:42,559
examination of those things

680
00:25:45,909 --> 00:25:43,600
i think

681
00:25:48,630 --> 00:25:45,919
the more ufo stories i look at the more

682
00:25:51,909 --> 00:25:48,640
appreciation i have for the overlap

683
00:25:53,750 --> 00:25:51,919
between uh between these areas i i think

684
00:25:55,510 --> 00:25:53,760
it also

685
00:25:57,430 --> 00:25:55,520
has has made me

686
00:26:01,750 --> 00:25:57,440
some of the other some other aspects of

687
00:26:04,470 --> 00:26:01,760
ufology have made me more cynical about

688
00:26:06,950 --> 00:26:04,480
uh the phenomenon in general the endless

689
00:26:08,549 --> 00:26:06,960
wrangling the last few years over this

690
00:26:11,990 --> 00:26:08,559
government agency or that government

691
00:26:13,750 --> 00:26:12,000
agency or this um

692
00:26:17,510 --> 00:26:13,760
organization you know

693
00:26:21,430 --> 00:26:17,520
selling stock to promote their their ufo

694
00:26:24,149 --> 00:26:21,440
activity there's you know the

695
00:26:25,350 --> 00:26:24,159
cue the jane pauley clip about unlimited

696
00:26:27,190 --> 00:26:25,360
financial

697
00:26:28,710 --> 00:26:27,200
opportunity um and and yes the

698
00:26:30,870 --> 00:26:28,720
government stuff is a financial

699
00:26:34,310 --> 00:26:30,880
opportunity for someone because things

700
00:26:35,350 --> 00:26:34,320
get contracted out and um with some of

701
00:26:38,549 --> 00:26:35,360
those things there are people who've

702
00:26:41,909 --> 00:26:38,559
done much much better work uh on on

703
00:26:43,350 --> 00:26:41,919
those topics than i have but uh but some

704
00:26:45,269 --> 00:26:43,360
aspects that have made me a bit more

705
00:26:48,390 --> 00:26:45,279
cynical about

706
00:26:50,630 --> 00:26:48,400
the the the field um but uh but overall

707
00:26:53,350 --> 00:26:50,640
nothing nothing earth-shattering um an

708
00:26:54,549 --> 00:26:53,360
appreciation for

709
00:26:56,630 --> 00:26:54,559
ufos have given me a greater

710
00:26:58,950 --> 00:26:56,640
appreciation for ghosts and cryptids

711
00:27:00,710 --> 00:26:58,960
basically the more i look at them

712
00:27:02,230 --> 00:27:00,720
all right next part of this multi-part

713
00:27:04,230 --> 00:27:02,240
question as an academic who works on

714
00:27:05,590 --> 00:27:04,240
saucers in his legit work what

715
00:27:07,269 --> 00:27:05,600
suggestions would you give to someone

716
00:27:08,950 --> 00:27:07,279
who wants to do the same i'm getting my

717
00:27:10,310 --> 00:27:08,960
phd in religious studies and i really

718
00:27:12,630 --> 00:27:10,320
want to do a project on belief

719
00:27:14,630 --> 00:27:12,640
hegeography and the contact ease at some

720
00:27:16,149 --> 00:27:14,640
point i have a rough outline but i don't

721
00:27:18,630 --> 00:27:16,159
know how to pitch it in a way that's

722
00:27:22,710 --> 00:27:18,640
palatable to my less ufologically

723
00:27:24,549 --> 00:27:22,720
inclined colleagues um i think the best

724
00:27:26,870 --> 00:27:24,559
thing to do

725
00:27:28,070 --> 00:27:26,880
is to

726
00:27:31,029 --> 00:27:28,080
talk to

727
00:27:35,830 --> 00:27:31,039
you're working with

728
00:27:38,630 --> 00:27:35,840
and go to them sort of um prepared with

729
00:27:40,149 --> 00:27:38,640
bibliographies of the work that uh

730
00:27:43,669 --> 00:27:40,159
religious studies scholars like david

731
00:27:47,190 --> 00:27:43,679
halperin for example have been doing for

732
00:27:48,950 --> 00:27:47,200
decades um there there's been a long

733
00:27:51,029 --> 00:27:48,960
strand of

734
00:27:53,750 --> 00:27:51,039
of religious studies scholars looking at

735
00:27:55,269 --> 00:27:53,760
ufos particularly contactees

736
00:27:57,590 --> 00:27:55,279
and um

737
00:27:59,750 --> 00:27:57,600
you know go go to jstor find some of

738
00:28:00,870 --> 00:27:59,760
that stuff and

739
00:28:03,110 --> 00:28:00,880
of course

740
00:28:06,070 --> 00:28:03,120
names are except for david halperin are

741
00:28:09,750 --> 00:28:06,080
slipping out of my head um

742
00:28:13,510 --> 00:28:09,760
jeffrey kreipel and uh

743
00:28:15,430 --> 00:28:13,520
the american cosmic person whose name i

744
00:28:18,310 --> 00:28:15,440
i i always

745
00:28:20,870 --> 00:28:18,320
forget um

746
00:28:22,230 --> 00:28:20,880
pasulka i think um

747
00:28:23,029 --> 00:28:22,240
they're good

748
00:28:24,549 --> 00:28:23,039
but

749
00:28:26,149 --> 00:28:24,559
they're

750
00:28:27,350 --> 00:28:26,159
i i would

751
00:28:28,710 --> 00:28:27,360
if you find their stuff find their stuff

752
00:28:30,630 --> 00:28:28,720
that's in that's in the peer-reviewed

753
00:28:32,230 --> 00:28:30,640
journals not not the the popular stuff

754
00:28:34,389 --> 00:28:32,240
if you're trying to persuade

755
00:28:36,310 --> 00:28:34,399
your committee or your advisor that that

756
00:28:37,110 --> 00:28:36,320
this is a fruitful area to go to you

757
00:28:39,350 --> 00:28:37,120
know

758
00:28:43,430 --> 00:28:39,360
there's this long there's this long sort

759
00:28:46,710 --> 00:28:43,440
of strand of scholarship on on ufos and

760
00:28:48,870 --> 00:28:46,720
and contact these as well and my work is

761
00:28:52,070 --> 00:28:48,880
going to build on that reinterpret that

762
00:28:54,789 --> 00:28:52,080
in whichever way um that's that's kind

763
00:28:57,590 --> 00:28:54,799
of what i did i i sort of had to sort of

764
00:29:00,310 --> 00:28:57,600
build up this this evidence that um that

765
00:29:02,630 --> 00:29:00,320
i'm not just making my own thing up if

766
00:29:05,350 --> 00:29:02,640
that makes sense all right we started

767
00:29:07,110 --> 00:29:05,360
out with sort of a a big one um

768
00:29:09,830 --> 00:29:07,120
here's another one working on which

769
00:29:14,710 --> 00:29:09,840
episode has most changed your opinion on

770
00:29:17,669 --> 00:29:14,720
a case or an aspect of ufology

771
00:29:21,190 --> 00:29:17,679
oh that's a good one um i think oh gosh

772
00:29:23,669 --> 00:29:21,200
which case i or which episode i think

773
00:29:28,630 --> 00:29:23,679
honestly

774
00:29:30,710 --> 00:29:28,640
um on the

775
00:29:32,310 --> 00:29:30,720
the mill labs episodes and the

776
00:29:34,230 --> 00:29:32,320
controllers episode

777
00:29:35,510 --> 00:29:34,240
really sort of hammered home that that

778
00:29:38,310 --> 00:29:35,520
even if it's not

779
00:29:40,630 --> 00:29:38,320
you know the sole explanation for the uh

780
00:29:41,510 --> 00:29:40,640
for the abduction phenomenon

781
00:29:45,510 --> 00:29:41,520
thing

782
00:29:47,909 --> 00:29:45,520
that some kind of terrestrial chicanery

783
00:29:49,750 --> 00:29:47,919
is uh is at play and i'd always sort of

784
00:29:52,070 --> 00:29:49,760
like oh yeah someone's probably like

785
00:29:54,630 --> 00:29:52,080
that sort of thing but uh but but

786
00:29:58,149 --> 00:29:54,640
reading some of those books reading um

787
00:30:00,149 --> 00:29:58,159
leah haley's books also uh the millaps

788
00:30:02,310 --> 00:30:00,159
thing i think has become one of those

789
00:30:05,430 --> 00:30:02,320
things that it's

790
00:30:06,950 --> 00:30:05,440
it's not one of the fun topics right and

791
00:30:09,669 --> 00:30:06,960
then when you get to things like the

792
00:30:12,149 --> 00:30:09,679
montauk project where you've got just

793
00:30:13,750 --> 00:30:12,159
these these sort of

794
00:30:17,430 --> 00:30:13,760
outlandish

795
00:30:19,909 --> 00:30:17,440
tales um that but also have a a sort of

796
00:30:21,750 --> 00:30:19,919
government experiment

797
00:30:24,149 --> 00:30:21,760
sort of thread to them

798
00:30:27,269 --> 00:30:24,159
it sort of makes me sort of frustrated

799
00:30:30,789 --> 00:30:27,279
that that the outlandish stories

800
00:30:32,710 --> 00:30:30,799
always get more uh more attention um

801
00:30:35,190 --> 00:30:32,720
because they're easier to to just sort

802
00:30:37,909 --> 00:30:35,200
of sort of dismiss so i think that

803
00:30:39,190 --> 00:30:37,919
strand has has not necessarily changed

804
00:30:42,630 --> 00:30:39,200
my opinion

805
00:30:46,630 --> 00:30:42,640
but uh but has made me more

806
00:30:48,549 --> 00:30:46,640
aware of it's more more alert to its

807
00:30:51,590 --> 00:30:48,559
significance now most

808
00:30:54,070 --> 00:30:51,600
actually has anyone changed my opinion

809
00:30:56,870 --> 00:30:54,080
on a case or an aspect of

810
00:30:58,630 --> 00:30:56,880
ufology

811
00:31:01,669 --> 00:30:58,640
um

812
00:31:04,710 --> 00:31:01,679
i think the orpheo angelucci case

813
00:31:06,630 --> 00:31:04,720
is sort of my well it is my go-to case

814
00:31:09,350 --> 00:31:06,640
uh whenever anybody asks me do you think

815
00:31:11,669 --> 00:31:09,360
any of these contactees any act actually

816
00:31:13,190 --> 00:31:11,679
ever experienced anything i i point to

817
00:31:14,630 --> 00:31:13,200
the orpheo angelucci case i don't know

818
00:31:17,350 --> 00:31:14,640
what he experienced

819
00:31:20,070 --> 00:31:17,360
but he experienced something and until i

820
00:31:21,909 --> 00:31:20,080
got more deeply into that case i i just

821
00:31:23,269 --> 00:31:21,919
thought it was another contacty case of

822
00:31:25,830 --> 00:31:23,279
of somebody

823
00:31:28,149 --> 00:31:25,840
somebody with an ideological

824
00:31:30,710 --> 00:31:28,159
position to promote who

825
00:31:32,389 --> 00:31:30,720
cloaked it in saucers to to get into

826
00:31:34,950 --> 00:31:32,399
that uh to get into that

827
00:31:35,750 --> 00:31:34,960
uh in into that audience but uh i i

828
00:31:37,830 --> 00:31:35,760
think

829
00:31:39,909 --> 00:31:37,840
milabs and orpheo angelucci two

830
00:31:42,310 --> 00:31:39,919
significant cases that have altered my

831
00:31:44,549 --> 00:31:42,320
thinking in a way um

832
00:31:47,029 --> 00:31:44,559
two very different uh topics to sort of

833
00:31:49,110 --> 00:31:47,039
respond to that all right who do you

834
00:31:50,950 --> 00:31:49,120
think would win in a fight ashtar or

835
00:31:53,350 --> 00:31:50,960
valiant thor

836
00:31:58,470 --> 00:31:56,070
a straight up

837
00:32:01,269 --> 00:31:58,480
stand-up fight

838
00:32:03,350 --> 00:32:01,279
probably valiant thor uh valiant thor he

839
00:32:05,909 --> 00:32:03,360
was on earth in a physical body he had

840
00:32:09,750 --> 00:32:05,919
to sort of get along in that uh in that

841
00:32:11,509 --> 00:32:09,760
um that realm ashtar kind of ethereal

842
00:32:14,149 --> 00:32:11,519
he's got his spaceships he doesn't

843
00:32:16,630 --> 00:32:14,159
really get his hands dirty i i think i

844
00:32:18,549 --> 00:32:16,640
think valiant thor would uh would win in

845
00:32:20,389 --> 00:32:18,559
a fight um

846
00:32:23,509 --> 00:32:20,399
and i i think valiant thor would know

847
00:32:26,830 --> 00:32:23,519
how to end a fight quickly

848
00:32:29,669 --> 00:32:26,840
what is a ufologist

849
00:32:31,110 --> 00:32:29,679
i it's anything you want it to be man

850
00:32:33,269 --> 00:32:31,120
are there rhetorical questions from the

851
00:32:36,149 --> 00:32:33,279
mufon field guide and the gre admissions

852
00:32:37,830 --> 00:32:36,159
exam to become one man you know what i

853
00:32:41,110 --> 00:32:37,840
haven't taken the gre in a really long

854
00:32:43,029 --> 00:32:41,120
time but uh i don't think there are and

855
00:32:45,509 --> 00:32:43,039
honestly

856
00:32:48,389 --> 00:32:45,519
i'm i mean i'm kind of being

857
00:32:49,830 --> 00:32:48,399
facetious but i'm i'm kind of not really

858
00:32:51,590 --> 00:32:49,840
you can you can call yourself a

859
00:32:53,190 --> 00:32:51,600
ufologist and and what's some what's

860
00:32:55,110 --> 00:32:53,200
somebody going to say

861
00:32:56,950 --> 00:32:55,120
well you haven't conducted any field

862
00:32:58,549 --> 00:32:56,960
investigations you can be an

863
00:33:01,669 --> 00:32:58,559
archaeologist without being a field

864
00:33:05,750 --> 00:33:03,190
you you can

865
00:33:07,350 --> 00:33:05,760
you can be a a psychologist without

866
00:33:10,149 --> 00:33:07,360
being a clinical psychologist there are

867
00:33:12,149 --> 00:33:10,159
different ways to do things and this is

868
00:33:15,190 --> 00:33:12,159
compounded by the fact that ufology

869
00:33:17,269 --> 00:33:15,200
isn't even a real thing it is a a field

870
00:33:20,389 --> 00:33:17,279
that is made up to make

871
00:33:23,269 --> 00:33:20,399
the study of flying saucers sound like a

872
00:33:24,789 --> 00:33:23,279
scientific endeavor when really

873
00:33:27,590 --> 00:33:24,799
it's

874
00:33:30,710 --> 00:33:27,600
okay um

875
00:33:32,630 --> 00:33:30,720
getting off my uh getting off my soapbox

876
00:33:34,630 --> 00:33:32,640
um

877
00:33:37,509 --> 00:33:34,640
if the italian aliens made buckwheat

878
00:33:42,310 --> 00:33:37,519
pancakes who makes blueberry um

879
00:33:47,909 --> 00:33:44,230
you know who makes blueberry pancakes

880
00:33:49,750 --> 00:33:47,919
aliens from uh northern indiana and and

881
00:33:52,470 --> 00:33:49,760
and southern michigan good blueberry

882
00:33:54,149 --> 00:33:52,480
land around uh around this area that's

883
00:33:55,430 --> 00:33:54,159
all i'm saying are there aliens from the

884
00:33:56,549 --> 00:33:55,440
midwest

885
00:33:59,029 --> 00:33:56,559
why not

886
00:34:01,350 --> 00:33:59,039
why didn't simonton use syrup was he the

887
00:34:04,470 --> 00:34:01,360
alien all the all along yeah you know

888
00:34:06,470 --> 00:34:04,480
what certain a syrupless pancake is is

889
00:34:08,629 --> 00:34:06,480
really the um

890
00:34:11,109 --> 00:34:08,639
it's the one unforgivable sin really

891
00:34:13,030 --> 00:34:11,119
it's just dry i mean oh but i have a

892
00:34:14,310 --> 00:34:13,040
fruit compote i'm putting on my pancake

893
00:34:18,149 --> 00:34:14,320
get out of here with that you know give

894
00:34:20,470 --> 00:34:18,159
me some actual maple syrup otherwise

895
00:34:22,710 --> 00:34:20,480
otherwise just eat a piece of eat a

896
00:34:24,790 --> 00:34:22,720
piece of cardboard all right what is the

897
00:34:27,430 --> 00:34:24,800
ufo crypto paranormal subject that you

898
00:34:28,710 --> 00:34:27,440
just can't help rolling your eyes at

899
00:34:30,310 --> 00:34:28,720
disclosure

900
00:34:31,669 --> 00:34:30,320
the idea that if we lobby the right

901
00:34:33,190 --> 00:34:31,679
people at the right time with the right

902
00:34:34,629 --> 00:34:33,200
circumstances we're going to get all the

903
00:34:37,190 --> 00:34:34,639
answers to everything that's been kept a

904
00:34:39,829 --> 00:34:37,200
secret since 1940 whatever that's that's

905
00:34:42,790 --> 00:34:39,839
the one that's the one that i just

906
00:34:43,669 --> 00:34:42,800
just violently sort of angrily chuckle

907
00:34:46,790 --> 00:34:43,679
at

908
00:34:50,310 --> 00:34:46,800
disclosure any any disclosurey sort of

909
00:34:51,909 --> 00:34:50,320
thing up to and including congressional

910
00:34:54,550 --> 00:34:51,919
hearings i don't care

911
00:34:56,790 --> 00:34:54,560
i don't i don't care it's not fun

912
00:34:58,870 --> 00:34:56,800
it's not fun and

913
00:35:00,230 --> 00:34:58,880
ufos are not life and death i need them

914
00:35:02,069 --> 00:35:00,240
to be fun

915
00:35:05,270 --> 00:35:02,079
speaking of fun who is your favorite

916
00:35:06,630 --> 00:35:05,280
paranormal media personality ooh living

917
00:35:07,589 --> 00:35:06,640
or dead

918
00:35:10,790 --> 00:35:07,599
um

919
00:35:11,750 --> 00:35:10,800
if it's all time it's got to be art bell

920
00:35:13,349 --> 00:35:11,760
if it's

921
00:35:14,470 --> 00:35:13,359
currently

922
00:35:17,670 --> 00:35:14,480
living

923
00:35:22,150 --> 00:35:20,069
oh gosh

924
00:35:24,870 --> 00:35:22,160
tim bernal tim benall is my favorite

925
00:35:27,510 --> 00:35:24,880
paranormal media personality um because

926
00:35:29,510 --> 00:35:27,520
he he basically invented uh ufo

927
00:35:33,109 --> 00:35:29,520
podcasting back before podcasting was

928
00:35:34,870 --> 00:35:33,119
was really a thing and um he uh

929
00:35:37,910 --> 00:35:34,880
he he keeps a

930
00:35:40,630 --> 00:35:37,920
a healthy perspective on things and he's

931
00:35:43,430 --> 00:35:40,640
fun to listen to so tim bernal favorite

932
00:35:45,750 --> 00:35:43,440
paranormal media personality

933
00:35:48,310 --> 00:35:45,760
does the saucer wife know what she was

934
00:35:50,470 --> 00:35:48,320
getting into ufo-wise um

935
00:35:52,310 --> 00:35:50,480
she's not here to answer that herself

936
00:35:56,069 --> 00:35:52,320
she answered a similar question on a

937
00:35:58,870 --> 00:35:56,079
patreon um ask us anything uh but uh but

938
00:35:59,829 --> 00:35:58,880
yes she uh she did um by the time she

939
00:36:01,030 --> 00:35:59,839
and i

940
00:36:03,589 --> 00:36:01,040
um

941
00:36:05,990 --> 00:36:03,599
got together i was in the beginning

942
00:36:08,710 --> 00:36:06,000
stages of doing the research

943
00:36:11,829 --> 00:36:08,720
for my master's thesis about um about

944
00:36:14,310 --> 00:36:11,839
cold war ufo belief and so she she knew

945
00:36:16,550 --> 00:36:14,320
what she was getting into as far as the

946
00:36:19,109 --> 00:36:16,560
as far as the ufos went and she was

947
00:36:21,670 --> 00:36:19,119
she was okay with it because she

948
00:36:23,990 --> 00:36:21,680
she saw it sort of as i did as well she

949
00:36:25,109 --> 00:36:24,000
saw that i was sort of doing this as an

950
00:36:27,349 --> 00:36:25,119
academic

951
00:36:30,310 --> 00:36:27,359
endeavor now if she would have uh come

952
00:36:32,870 --> 00:36:30,320
over to my place and ignored the

953
00:36:35,829 --> 00:36:32,880
sort of slovenly bachelor clutter and

954
00:36:38,150 --> 00:36:35,839
had her eyes fall on my ufo bookshelf

955
00:36:40,390 --> 00:36:38,160
before she knew any of that

956
00:36:42,550 --> 00:36:40,400
things might have gone um differently

957
00:36:45,109 --> 00:36:42,560
fortunately the pro wrestling and doctor

958
00:36:48,069 --> 00:36:45,119
who fandom uh kind of

959
00:36:50,230 --> 00:36:48,079
kind of was a um a good cloak for the uh

960
00:36:52,470 --> 00:36:50,240
she she was you know had not she had

961
00:36:55,829 --> 00:36:52,480
enough to be concerned about without my

962
00:36:57,910 --> 00:36:55,839
uh without my ufo endeavors are you ever

963
00:37:00,470 --> 00:36:57,920
going to advertise you know i've thought

964
00:37:01,750 --> 00:37:00,480
about that and um

965
00:37:03,510 --> 00:37:01,760
i don't know i

966
00:37:04,230 --> 00:37:03,520
i don't think so you know for podca i

967
00:37:06,870 --> 00:37:04,240
mean

968
00:37:09,109 --> 00:37:06,880
podcast is the size where i could do the

969
00:37:12,790 --> 00:37:09,119
signing up with an advertising

970
00:37:14,150 --> 00:37:12,800
outfit and they put in ads and

971
00:37:16,710 --> 00:37:14,160
things like that but it's stuff that's

972
00:37:19,829 --> 00:37:16,720
unrelated to um

973
00:37:22,310 --> 00:37:19,839
to to the show or the the content um and

974
00:37:25,109 --> 00:37:22,320
that just seems

975
00:37:27,670 --> 00:37:25,119
weird um i've thought about just trying

976
00:37:30,150 --> 00:37:27,680
to offer ad space

977
00:37:31,510 --> 00:37:30,160
to people who have

978
00:37:33,190 --> 00:37:31,520
you know a book or a conference or

979
00:37:35,030 --> 00:37:33,200
something but

980
00:37:36,630 --> 00:37:35,040
then if i don't know who they are and

981
00:37:38,310 --> 00:37:36,640
i'm not familiar with their work then i

982
00:37:40,069 --> 00:37:38,320
really feel i need to get familiar with

983
00:37:41,670 --> 00:37:40,079
them in their work because otherwise it

984
00:37:43,990 --> 00:37:41,680
feels like i'm endorsing something and

985
00:37:45,349 --> 00:37:44,000
then i get somebody on twitter saying so

986
00:37:47,109 --> 00:37:45,359
why do you carry advertising from

987
00:37:49,750 --> 00:37:47,119
somebody who has a chapter in their book

988
00:37:51,829 --> 00:37:49,760
entitled hitler he had some good ideas

989
00:37:54,710 --> 00:37:51,839
you know so then you know it gets into

990
00:37:57,190 --> 00:37:54,720
this whole this whole vetting process of

991
00:37:59,510 --> 00:37:57,200
that and pretty soon you're doing enough

992
00:38:02,470 --> 00:37:59,520
work that it's it's sort of outstripping

993
00:38:05,109 --> 00:38:02,480
the benefit from the advertising so

994
00:38:06,950 --> 00:38:05,119
probably uh probably not uh now i will

995
00:38:09,910 --> 00:38:06,960
say and you'll hear it at the end of of

996
00:38:11,829 --> 00:38:09,920
this episode um if if a friend has a

997
00:38:13,829 --> 00:38:11,839
promo they want to run and i'm familiar

998
00:38:15,430 --> 00:38:13,839
with them yeah i'll do that that's no

999
00:38:17,430 --> 00:38:15,440
problem at all uh

1000
00:38:18,550 --> 00:38:17,440
strange realities conference that uh sam

1001
00:38:21,030 --> 00:38:18,560
and i are going to be speaking at in

1002
00:38:23,589 --> 00:38:21,040
october yeah absolutely we'll run that

1003
00:38:25,589 --> 00:38:23,599
so it's it's more of a i will

1004
00:38:27,829 --> 00:38:25,599
i don't do advertising i'll do favors

1005
00:38:28,950 --> 00:38:27,839
for my friends you know because

1006
00:38:31,270 --> 00:38:28,960
you know

1007
00:38:32,550 --> 00:38:31,280
why not so

1008
00:38:35,829 --> 00:38:32,560
advertising

1009
00:38:39,109 --> 00:38:35,839
not uh not really all right why has the

1010
00:38:41,030 --> 00:38:39,119
variety in ufo occupants morphology

1011
00:38:41,990 --> 00:38:41,040
what they looked like decreased over the

1012
00:38:43,670 --> 00:38:42,000
years

1013
00:38:46,550 --> 00:38:43,680
we went from wrinkled clawed mummies and

1014
00:38:48,390 --> 00:38:46,560
one-eyed catfish men in the 1973 to

1015
00:38:50,630 --> 00:38:48,400
graze tall whites reptilians and

1016
00:38:54,310 --> 00:38:50,640
mantoids in the following decades what

1017
00:38:55,990 --> 00:38:54,320
can explain this seeming homogeneity

1018
00:38:59,750 --> 00:38:56,000
that is a

1019
00:39:01,990 --> 00:38:59,760
good question i think the fact that

1020
00:39:03,349 --> 00:39:02,000
the popular media latched on to a

1021
00:39:07,109 --> 00:39:03,359
particular

1022
00:39:10,870 --> 00:39:07,119
handful of types is a big factor in it i

1023
00:39:13,510 --> 00:39:10,880
think the rise of the contact d genre in

1024
00:39:16,710 --> 00:39:13,520
the late 70s and into the 80s and beyond

1025
00:39:19,430 --> 00:39:16,720
sort of cemented the grays as the as the

1026
00:39:20,310 --> 00:39:19,440
default alien and you might say well

1027
00:39:21,030 --> 00:39:20,320
you know

1028
00:39:22,710 --> 00:39:21,040
wha

1029
00:39:24,150 --> 00:39:22,720
guy in a jumpsuit was a default alien

1030
00:39:27,510 --> 00:39:24,160
for a long time but we still had that

1031
00:39:28,390 --> 00:39:27,520
variety i think another aspect of it was

1032
00:39:37,589 --> 00:39:28,400
as

1033
00:39:41,589 --> 00:39:37,599
becomes kind of monolithic in the late

1034
00:39:43,829 --> 00:39:41,599
70s and into the 80s and beyond

1035
00:39:46,630 --> 00:39:43,839
i think i think there were fewer places

1036
00:39:49,270 --> 00:39:46,640
for people to tell their stories of

1037
00:39:50,710 --> 00:39:49,280
weird humanoid encounters

1038
00:39:53,750 --> 00:39:50,720
in a place where it would get enough

1039
00:39:55,349 --> 00:39:53,760
traction for those stories to

1040
00:39:57,829 --> 00:39:55,359
make it to

1041
00:40:01,030 --> 00:39:57,839
the books we read or the magazines we

1042
00:40:03,829 --> 00:40:01,040
read or the websites we look at i think

1043
00:40:05,589 --> 00:40:03,839
you start to get among ufo investigators

1044
00:40:08,790 --> 00:40:05,599
and increasingly

1045
00:40:10,390 --> 00:40:08,800
sort of nuts and bolts gray abduction

1046
00:40:12,230 --> 00:40:10,400
oriented outlook

1047
00:40:14,710 --> 00:40:12,240
and so

1048
00:40:15,910 --> 00:40:14,720
people aren't going to report those

1049
00:40:17,750 --> 00:40:15,920
things or they do report those things

1050
00:40:19,990 --> 00:40:17,760
and the things are sort of filed away in

1051
00:40:22,150 --> 00:40:20,000
a cabinet and they don't make the mufon

1052
00:40:24,390 --> 00:40:22,160
journal they don't make um the

1053
00:40:25,990 --> 00:40:24,400
documentaries or things like that that's

1054
00:40:27,430 --> 00:40:26,000
uh that's the best answer i can come up

1055
00:40:30,710 --> 00:40:27,440
with for that

1056
00:40:33,349 --> 00:40:30,720
gonna write any more books uh um

1057
00:40:37,190 --> 00:40:33,359
man uh that last one took it out of me

1058
00:40:38,710 --> 00:40:37,200
uh if i do write anything

1059
00:40:40,470 --> 00:40:38,720
it's probably going to be something i

1060
00:40:42,550 --> 00:40:40,480
just sort of put out myself and it's not

1061
00:40:44,870 --> 00:40:42,560
going to be very long um i don't know

1062
00:40:47,589 --> 00:40:44,880
what's the what's the non-fiction

1063
00:40:49,990 --> 00:40:47,599
equivalent of a novella that that sort

1064
00:40:52,790 --> 00:40:50,000
of length um i've toyed around doing

1065
00:40:54,390 --> 00:40:52,800
something along the lines of um

1066
00:40:55,670 --> 00:40:54,400
sort of the essay collection like i did

1067
00:40:57,670 --> 00:40:55,680
with the chaos conundrum i think

1068
00:40:59,750 --> 00:40:57,680
anything i do would be sort of a series

1069
00:41:01,750 --> 00:40:59,760
of short things but i've got no

1070
00:41:03,670 --> 00:41:01,760
actual concrete plans

1071
00:41:05,430 --> 00:41:03,680
what are your thoughts on valet's recent

1072
00:41:08,150 --> 00:41:05,440
ufo stuff lots of people seemed upset

1073
00:41:10,950 --> 00:41:08,160
about trinity but i really enjoyed it i

1074
00:41:13,109 --> 00:41:10,960
have not read trinity uh i'll be honest

1075
00:41:15,750 --> 00:41:13,119
i um i i

1076
00:41:18,309 --> 00:41:15,760
i'll probably read it just so i i know

1077
00:41:22,950 --> 00:41:18,319
what people are talking about but

1078
00:41:27,349 --> 00:41:24,870
paolo harris's name on the cover and and

1079
00:41:29,589 --> 00:41:27,359
her her reputation precedes her as

1080
00:41:31,430 --> 00:41:29,599
somebody who is is not

1081
00:41:33,430 --> 00:41:31,440
somebody who approaches things in a way

1082
00:41:35,430 --> 00:41:33,440
i would find interesting or useful

1083
00:41:37,430 --> 00:41:35,440
and if valet has found something

1084
00:41:39,109 --> 00:41:37,440
interesting or useful from that that's

1085
00:41:40,790 --> 00:41:39,119
great um

1086
00:42:09,670 --> 00:41:40,800
i

1087
00:42:10,630 --> 00:42:09,680
of

1088
00:42:13,589 --> 00:42:10,640
um

1089
00:42:16,150 --> 00:42:13,599
the sort of semi

1090
00:42:20,150 --> 00:42:16,160
i don't say saint-like but this revered

1091
00:42:22,550 --> 00:42:20,160
figure um when when really i mean

1092
00:42:25,349 --> 00:42:22,560
maybe but in the end he's talking about

1093
00:42:27,829 --> 00:42:25,359
ufos so

1094
00:42:29,910 --> 00:42:27,839
in the grand scheme of things uh i i

1095
00:42:31,910 --> 00:42:29,920
think he did some important work with i

1096
00:42:33,190 --> 00:42:31,920
think passport to magonia was was was

1097
00:42:35,910 --> 00:42:33,200
very

1098
00:42:37,910 --> 00:42:35,920
sort of sort of significant um

1099
00:42:40,230 --> 00:42:37,920
i think that uh i think messengers of

1100
00:42:43,109 --> 00:42:40,240
deception is is still probably one of my

1101
00:42:44,710 --> 00:42:43,119
favorite uh books about the subject but

1102
00:42:46,309 --> 00:42:44,720
the recent stuff i haven't really gotten

1103
00:42:48,550 --> 00:42:46,319
into it that much

1104
00:42:51,030 --> 00:42:48,560
what's the bermuda triangle to up

1105
00:42:53,109 --> 00:42:51,040
uh what is the bermuda triangle up to

1106
00:42:55,910 --> 00:42:53,119
lately well the most recent incident i

1107
00:42:58,150 --> 00:42:55,920
could find was 2020 the 29-foot blue and

1108
00:43:01,109 --> 00:42:58,160
white mako cuddy cabin vessel with 20 on

1109
00:43:03,589 --> 00:43:01,119
board was last seen publicly on december

1110
00:43:06,630 --> 00:43:03,599
28 2020 and there were some aircraft

1111
00:43:08,390 --> 00:43:06,640
losses uh back in the 20 teens so

1112
00:43:10,230 --> 00:43:08,400
the uh the

1113
00:43:14,390 --> 00:43:10,240
bermuda triangle still

1114
00:43:16,950 --> 00:43:14,400
uh chewing them up and spitting them out

1115
00:43:18,950 --> 00:43:16,960
of all the famous and or respected ufo

1116
00:43:20,069 --> 00:43:18,960
researchers of the past 70 years is

1117
00:43:22,550 --> 00:43:20,079
there one who you've always found

1118
00:43:24,790 --> 00:43:22,560
suspicious or believed to have been a

1119
00:43:26,150 --> 00:43:24,800
complete liar or fraud someone who the

1120
00:43:28,390 --> 00:43:26,160
majority of people with an interest in

1121
00:43:30,710 --> 00:43:28,400
ufology would never doubt for a second

1122
00:43:35,270 --> 00:43:30,720
who would that be and why do you feel

1123
00:43:38,829 --> 00:43:35,280
that way oh wow complete liar or fraud

1124
00:43:41,589 --> 00:43:38,839
um is is strong

1125
00:43:46,069 --> 00:43:41,599
um oh

1126
00:43:47,510 --> 00:43:46,079
oh how do i say anything without um

1127
00:43:49,270 --> 00:43:47,520
like most of the names that come to mind

1128
00:43:51,030 --> 00:43:49,280
are are people that'll be like

1129
00:43:52,710 --> 00:43:51,040
oh yeah well he's always been kind of

1130
00:43:55,109 --> 00:43:52,720
shady but

1131
00:43:57,510 --> 00:43:55,119
um

1132
00:44:00,630 --> 00:43:57,520
okay i'll say this

1133
00:44:06,710 --> 00:44:03,990
i think unwittingly

1134
00:44:08,870 --> 00:44:06,720
stanton friedman probably

1135
00:44:10,390 --> 00:44:08,880
did more harm than good to ufology after

1136
00:44:12,870 --> 00:44:10,400
a certain point

1137
00:44:15,430 --> 00:44:12,880
continuing to push roswell continuing

1138
00:44:18,230 --> 00:44:15,440
especially to push the mj-12 narrative

1139
00:44:21,589 --> 00:44:18,240
um i think that

1140
00:44:24,710 --> 00:44:21,599
i think that did some damage um

1141
00:44:26,870 --> 00:44:24,720
because those strands became so dominant

1142
00:44:30,230 --> 00:44:26,880
and so overpowering and i the thing is i

1143
00:44:32,390 --> 00:44:30,240
do not doubt friedman's sincerity at all

1144
00:44:36,550 --> 00:44:32,400
i would never call him a liar or a fraud

1145
00:44:39,349 --> 00:44:36,560
or even suspicious but i i think that i

1146
00:44:43,270 --> 00:44:39,359
i think that the angles he pushed

1147
00:44:45,430 --> 00:44:43,280
um often especially with mj 12 in the

1148
00:44:48,150 --> 00:44:45,440
face of

1149
00:44:51,190 --> 00:44:48,160
significant and convincing to me anyway

1150
00:44:52,710 --> 00:44:51,200
contrary evidence um i i think i think

1151
00:44:54,390 --> 00:44:52,720
that is a uh

1152
00:44:56,150 --> 00:44:54,400
i think that's a negative

1153
00:44:57,990 --> 00:44:56,160
although he used the word flying saucer

1154
00:44:59,829 --> 00:44:58,000
in his the name of his presentation so

1155
00:45:02,309 --> 00:44:59,839
he's got he had that going for him he's

1156
00:45:04,150 --> 00:45:02,319
a very nice man who who did work very

1157
00:45:05,910 --> 00:45:04,160
hard and again i i am not saying

1158
00:45:07,829 --> 00:45:05,920
anything against his character i just

1159
00:45:10,230 --> 00:45:07,839
think that that his focus on those

1160
00:45:11,190 --> 00:45:10,240
angles and his promotion of those angles

1161
00:45:13,430 --> 00:45:11,200
um

1162
00:45:15,190 --> 00:45:13,440
sort of sort of put ufology on the

1163
00:45:17,750 --> 00:45:15,200
course that that it ended up being on

1164
00:45:19,349 --> 00:45:17,760
for a very long time even uh even to the

1165
00:45:21,270 --> 00:45:19,359
present

1166
00:45:23,990 --> 00:45:21,280
okay are you familiar with the old time

1167
00:45:26,150 --> 00:45:24,000
as in 1982 radio drama universe hollow

1168
00:45:28,150 --> 00:45:26,160
from the cbs radio mystery theater

1169
00:45:29,750 --> 00:45:28,160
there's a link here its close encounters

1170
00:45:31,510 --> 00:45:29,760
of the fifth or maybe fourth kind meets

1171
00:45:33,750 --> 00:45:31,520
heaven's gate narrated by a cynical

1172
00:45:35,670 --> 00:45:33,760
reporter who finds true love it reminded

1173
00:45:37,270 --> 00:45:35,680
me of your holiday special speaking of

1174
00:45:39,910 --> 00:45:37,280
which have you thought of expanding

1175
00:45:42,630 --> 00:45:39,920
children of agalon into a screenplay no

1176
00:45:45,750 --> 00:45:42,640
i have not um just getting a

1177
00:45:50,950 --> 00:45:45,760
a very amateur audio production was um

1178
00:45:52,470 --> 00:45:50,960
uh was was sort of very very daunting um

1179
00:45:53,990 --> 00:45:52,480
and i'm not sure what else i could flesh

1180
00:45:55,270 --> 00:45:54,000
out i don't know maybe i'll mess around

1181
00:45:57,829 --> 00:45:55,280
with that a little bit i'll turn it into

1182
00:45:59,430 --> 00:45:57,839
my first novel um and i've not heard

1183
00:46:01,990 --> 00:45:59,440
universe hollow but i am going to listen

1184
00:46:05,270 --> 00:46:02,000
to it because it very much sounds like

1185
00:46:07,109 --> 00:46:05,280
my sort of thing in a fight between

1186
00:46:09,109 --> 00:46:07,119
you know why are there so many fights in

1187
00:46:10,870 --> 00:46:09,119
a fight between mothman and the nazca

1188
00:46:12,950 --> 00:46:10,880
monkey who would win

1189
00:46:15,030 --> 00:46:12,960
um well the nazca monkey is already on

1190
00:46:16,390 --> 00:46:15,040
the ground so i think mothman has a

1191
00:46:18,390 --> 00:46:16,400
clear advantage

1192
00:46:22,710 --> 00:46:18,400
whatever happened to mk jessop's copy of

1193
00:46:25,349 --> 00:46:22,720
the original vero edition i have no idea

1194
00:46:26,950 --> 00:46:25,359
if anybody does let me know i have no

1195
00:46:28,790 --> 00:46:26,960
idea

1196
00:46:31,430 --> 00:46:28,800
your podcast is the source for all the

1197
00:46:33,750 --> 00:46:31,440
books that i buy hopefully just about

1198
00:46:35,030 --> 00:46:33,760
ufos not all your books ever i

1199
00:46:37,750 --> 00:46:35,040
understand that you will not cover some

1200
00:46:39,430 --> 00:46:37,760
topics out of fear uh fear annoyance yes

1201
00:46:40,870 --> 00:46:39,440
nervousness leaves me wondering what

1202
00:46:44,309 --> 00:46:40,880
those books are that i will never hear

1203
00:46:49,109 --> 00:46:44,319
about on the saucer life sad face um you

1204
00:46:52,550 --> 00:46:50,790
billy meyer

1205
00:46:54,630 --> 00:46:52,560
that's as far as i can think that's

1206
00:46:57,430 --> 00:46:54,640
probably the only topic that i'm not

1207
00:47:00,309 --> 00:46:57,440
going to cover billy myers

1208
00:47:02,069 --> 00:47:00,319
sightings and encounters over in

1209
00:47:03,430 --> 00:47:02,079
switzerland i

1210
00:47:04,230 --> 00:47:03,440
it

1211
00:47:10,470 --> 00:47:04,240
no

1212
00:47:12,630 --> 00:47:10,480
meyer's people

1213
00:47:14,950 --> 00:47:12,640
that people i've talked to have had

1214
00:47:16,470 --> 00:47:14,960
after talking about billy meyer so

1215
00:47:18,710 --> 00:47:16,480
billy meyer that's i think that might be

1216
00:47:20,150 --> 00:47:18,720
the only one that i'm like nope nope

1217
00:47:22,390 --> 00:47:20,160
nope not going to cover it even

1218
00:47:25,670 --> 00:47:22,400
something that i hate like roswell i

1219
00:47:27,670 --> 00:47:25,680
will probably do at some point

1220
00:47:29,190 --> 00:47:27,680
given access to a delorean time machine

1221
00:47:31,030 --> 00:47:29,200
style matters who would be the first

1222
00:47:33,430 --> 00:47:31,040
person you'd like to interview

1223
00:47:35,190 --> 00:47:33,440
for the podcast

1224
00:47:37,510 --> 00:47:35,200
um

1225
00:47:39,670 --> 00:47:37,520
i have to say

1226
00:47:43,270 --> 00:47:39,680
probably al bender

1227
00:47:44,790 --> 00:47:43,280
i would go back and talk to al bender

1228
00:47:46,069 --> 00:47:44,800
um

1229
00:47:48,069 --> 00:47:46,079
if i could

1230
00:47:49,510 --> 00:47:48,079
well sort of the caveat for all of these

1231
00:47:52,549 --> 00:47:49,520
if if i could

1232
00:47:54,630 --> 00:47:52,559
interview them and i knew they couldn't

1233
00:47:57,109 --> 00:47:54,640
lie to me and had to answer my questions

1234
00:48:00,309 --> 00:47:57,119
it would be al bender if they could lie

1235
00:48:02,069 --> 00:48:00,319
to me all they want then probably

1236
00:48:03,910 --> 00:48:02,079
gray barker

1237
00:48:04,950 --> 00:48:03,920
so yeah those would be those would be

1238
00:48:06,309 --> 00:48:04,960
the two

1239
00:48:07,750 --> 00:48:06,319
have you considered doing more rift

1240
00:48:09,670 --> 00:48:07,760
tracks type viewings with saucer wife

1241
00:48:11,829 --> 00:48:09,680
samantha weirdo friends lucky patreon

1242
00:48:14,309 --> 00:48:11,839
members yeah some watch along type stuff

1243
00:48:16,790 --> 00:48:14,319
uh not just for patreon but but maybe uh

1244
00:48:19,750 --> 00:48:16,800
in general some public domain fun saucer

1245
00:48:21,910 --> 00:48:19,760
stuff uh yeah yeah i've i've got some

1246
00:48:24,069 --> 00:48:21,920
ideas for something like that

1247
00:48:26,870 --> 00:48:24,079
have you read the book pale horse rider

1248
00:48:28,710 --> 00:48:26,880
yet yes i did um almost as soon as it

1249
00:48:30,630 --> 00:48:28,720
came out it's uh i think it did a great

1250
00:48:32,790 --> 00:48:30,640
job of revealing the person says

1251
00:48:34,549 --> 00:48:32,800
how full of it bill cooper really was i

1252
00:48:36,630 --> 00:48:34,559
guess my question is would you consider

1253
00:48:39,990 --> 00:48:36,640
doing a fact versus fiction bill cooper

1254
00:48:41,510 --> 00:48:40,000
episode in the future

1255
00:48:45,030 --> 00:48:41,520
maybe there might be room for a

1256
00:48:47,829 --> 00:48:45,040
follow-up bill cooper episode um

1257
00:48:50,150 --> 00:48:47,839
but mark jacobson's pale horse rider if

1258
00:48:53,190 --> 00:48:50,160
you're at all interested in

1259
00:48:57,109 --> 00:48:53,200
in bill cooper the person

1260
00:48:59,430 --> 00:48:57,119
as well as that entire sort of milieu he

1261
00:49:01,990 --> 00:48:59,440
was a part of in the 80s and 90s it is i

1262
00:49:03,349 --> 00:49:02,000
thought it was an excellent book

1263
00:49:04,950 --> 00:49:03,359
i understand that the name roberta

1264
00:49:07,190 --> 00:49:04,960
evangeline straith was inspired by the

1265
00:49:08,870 --> 00:49:07,200
infamous straight letter from whence

1266
00:49:10,950 --> 00:49:08,880
does the inspiration for the name sasha

1267
00:49:12,069 --> 00:49:10,960
gimlinson and simpson j hanover the

1268
00:49:15,510 --> 00:49:12,079
third come

1269
00:49:17,589 --> 00:49:15,520
are these also from famous ufo incidents

1270
00:49:20,309 --> 00:49:17,599
sasha gimlinson sasha was just a name i

1271
00:49:22,950 --> 00:49:20,319
came up with i think and gimlinson

1272
00:49:25,750 --> 00:49:22,960
um sort of a portmanteau of um

1273
00:49:29,910 --> 00:49:25,760
uh the gimlin uh patterson

1274
00:49:31,750 --> 00:49:29,920
uh bigfoot film uh simpson j hanover uh

1275
00:49:34,630 --> 00:49:31,760
the third

1276
00:49:38,630 --> 00:49:34,640
is actually that my my friend who has

1277
00:49:40,309 --> 00:49:38,640
that uh that uh num de podcast is uh

1278
00:49:42,950 --> 00:49:40,319
that is that is a

1279
00:49:46,069 --> 00:49:42,960
it's a literal

1280
00:49:48,630 --> 00:49:46,079
general use fake name that uh originated

1281
00:49:51,349 --> 00:49:48,640
with his grandfather so he is simpson j

1282
00:49:54,390 --> 00:49:51,359
hanover iii so that's uh that's his

1283
00:49:55,910 --> 00:49:54,400
standard uh standard fake name

1284
00:49:57,510 --> 00:49:55,920
what is your relationship to how did you

1285
00:49:58,390 --> 00:49:57,520
come to know simpson jay hanover the

1286
00:49:59,510 --> 00:49:58,400
third

1287
00:50:00,630 --> 00:49:59,520
um

1288
00:50:02,950 --> 00:50:00,640
we uh

1289
00:50:05,030 --> 00:50:02,960
uh friends since uh friends since high

1290
00:50:08,710 --> 00:50:05,040
school so for about

1291
00:50:10,870 --> 00:50:08,720
30 years at uh at this point and he was

1292
00:50:14,309 --> 00:50:10,880
my original creative partner in what at

1293
00:50:15,270 --> 00:50:14,319
the time was uh chizzo records actually

1294
00:50:17,589 --> 00:50:15,280
he and i've been friends for more than

1295
00:50:20,710 --> 00:50:17,599
30 years chiso records uh started in

1296
00:50:24,069 --> 00:50:20,720
1992 with some silly recording for an

1297
00:50:26,630 --> 00:50:24,079
audience of about four people um

1298
00:50:29,030 --> 00:50:26,640
and uh and so yeah so just uh just

1299
00:50:30,549 --> 00:50:29,040
long-time uh long-time friend

1300
00:50:31,750 --> 00:50:30,559
who's the first to come up with last

1301
00:50:34,230 --> 00:50:31,760
question who's the first to come up with

1302
00:50:36,470 --> 00:50:34,240
the idea of alien human hybrids and why

1303
00:50:38,710 --> 00:50:36,480
is it so popular it makes no biological

1304
00:50:41,190 --> 00:50:38,720
sense like trying to cross a tiger with

1305
00:50:43,190 --> 00:50:41,200
an oak and drives me insane because how

1306
00:50:46,630 --> 00:50:43,200
stupid it is

1307
00:50:48,069 --> 00:50:46,640
i don't know who came up with the actual

1308
00:50:50,150 --> 00:50:48,079
idea

1309
00:50:52,309 --> 00:50:50,160
first i know there

1310
00:50:53,589 --> 00:50:52,319
when it sort of takes root

1311
00:50:56,470 --> 00:50:53,599
in the

1312
00:50:58,150 --> 00:50:56,480
david jacobs-style abduction stuff

1313
00:51:01,589 --> 00:50:58,160
in the 90s

1314
00:51:04,309 --> 00:51:01,599
there's a long history of

1315
00:51:06,790 --> 00:51:04,319
medical experimentation type things that

1316
00:51:09,349 --> 00:51:06,800
could be used to sort of assume that

1317
00:51:12,549 --> 00:51:09,359
some kind of hybridization was taking

1318
00:51:14,630 --> 00:51:12,559
place going back to um to antonio vias

1319
00:51:16,309 --> 00:51:14,640
bois and the um

1320
00:51:18,150 --> 00:51:16,319
uh betty and bernie hill things like

1321
00:51:19,750 --> 00:51:18,160
that i don't know and there's probably a

1322
00:51:21,109 --> 00:51:19,760
really obvious answer that's slipping my

1323
00:51:23,030 --> 00:51:21,119
mind so

1324
00:51:24,710 --> 00:51:23,040
everybody feel free to uh to chime in

1325
00:51:26,230 --> 00:51:24,720
with what the the answer actually is but

1326
00:51:29,030 --> 00:51:26,240
i'm not sure who the first who literally

1327
00:51:31,670 --> 00:51:29,040
came up with the the hybridization idea

1328
00:51:34,390 --> 00:51:31,680
was and yes it it does make no

1329
00:51:37,270 --> 00:51:34,400
biological sense and i think it is so

1330
00:51:38,870 --> 00:51:37,280
popular because it's a they're able to

1331
00:51:40,549 --> 00:51:38,880
push a narrative

1332
00:51:42,950 --> 00:51:40,559
of um

1333
00:51:46,230 --> 00:51:42,960
of invaders who aren't quite like us

1334
00:51:49,990 --> 00:51:46,240
living among us and um and the human

1335
00:51:51,829 --> 00:51:50,000
race being replaced by something um by

1336
00:51:54,390 --> 00:51:51,839
something else um

1337
00:51:55,750 --> 00:51:54,400
which jacobs talked about in in his

1338
00:51:57,829 --> 00:51:55,760
books

1339
00:51:59,829 --> 00:51:57,839
well those are the questions that came

1340
00:52:02,150 --> 00:51:59,839
in which are great and now we're going

1341
00:52:03,910 --> 00:52:02,160
to sort of rapid fire go through

1342
00:52:06,549 --> 00:52:03,920
requested topics and i'll give you an

1343
00:52:07,589 --> 00:52:06,559
idea of how likely some of these are or

1344
00:52:09,109 --> 00:52:07,599
are not

1345
00:52:10,470 --> 00:52:09,119
all right absolutely utterly and

1346
00:52:12,309 --> 00:52:10,480
enthusiastically i would like you to

1347
00:52:14,069 --> 00:52:12,319
devote a full episode to the life of

1348
00:52:15,829 --> 00:52:14,079
gray barker you clearly have a great

1349
00:52:17,270 --> 00:52:15,839
appreciation for him and how integral he

1350
00:52:19,190 --> 00:52:17,280
was to the development of the flying

1351
00:52:20,790 --> 00:52:19,200
saucer field for better or worse he was

1352
00:52:22,309 --> 00:52:20,800
a fascinating man who deserves so much

1353
00:52:24,470 --> 00:52:22,319
more than he got and i think he would

1354
00:52:27,109 --> 00:52:24,480
cover him with the respect he deserves

1355
00:52:28,549 --> 00:52:27,119
uh thank you first of all and yes that

1356
00:52:30,549 --> 00:52:28,559
would be

1357
00:52:33,030 --> 00:52:30,559
amazing um

1358
00:52:34,549 --> 00:52:33,040
that would be amazing now there is a

1359
00:52:37,430 --> 00:52:34,559
scholar named and listener to the show

1360
00:52:40,309 --> 00:52:37,440
gabriel mckee who is working on a

1361
00:52:41,270 --> 00:52:40,319
history of barker's publishing efforts

1362
00:52:43,750 --> 00:52:41,280
and

1363
00:52:45,750 --> 00:52:43,760
i think that might fill in a lot of

1364
00:52:47,750 --> 00:52:45,760
blanks that maybe down the road would

1365
00:52:50,390 --> 00:52:47,760
allow me to do something like that and

1366
00:52:51,589 --> 00:52:50,400
when um when mckee's book is uh is out

1367
00:52:52,390 --> 00:52:51,599
there we are going to have him on the

1368
00:52:54,390 --> 00:52:52,400
show

1369
00:52:57,190 --> 00:52:54,400
for a conversation about grey barker's

1370
00:52:59,109 --> 00:52:57,200
publishing endeavors more classic

1371
00:53:00,790 --> 00:52:59,119
european and international cases the

1372
00:53:02,870 --> 00:53:00,800
malaysian japanese cases were ace and

1373
00:53:04,710 --> 00:53:02,880
maybe some more episodes focusing on how

1374
00:53:07,030 --> 00:53:04,720
the media culture was informed by

1375
00:53:08,470 --> 00:53:07,040
certain cases and in turn changed the

1376
00:53:10,549 --> 00:53:08,480
narrative everything from close

1377
00:53:11,829 --> 00:53:10,559
encounters to the six million dollar man

1378
00:53:14,390 --> 00:53:11,839
doing bigfoot

1379
00:53:16,150 --> 00:53:14,400
ufo bigfoot seems ripe for investigation

1380
00:53:18,790 --> 00:53:16,160
maybe more

1381
00:53:20,710 --> 00:53:18,800
jacques valet and ivan t sanderson a

1382
00:53:22,630 --> 00:53:20,720
number of requests for jacques vallee

1383
00:53:23,670 --> 00:53:22,640
ivan sanderson episodes we're going to

1384
00:53:27,430 --> 00:53:23,680
be doing

1385
00:53:29,990 --> 00:53:27,440
ivan some ivan sanderson stuff in

1386
00:53:33,270 --> 00:53:30,000
early next year i think is uh is the

1387
00:53:34,549 --> 00:53:33,280
plan european and international cases um

1388
00:53:35,910 --> 00:53:34,559
yes we are going to be doing more of

1389
00:53:37,670 --> 00:53:35,920
those

1390
00:53:40,829 --> 00:53:37,680
the um

1391
00:53:43,030 --> 00:53:40,839
my hesitation with that has always

1392
00:53:44,549 --> 00:53:43,040
been um

1393
00:53:47,349 --> 00:53:44,559
linguistic

1394
00:53:49,829 --> 00:53:47,359
i i like using

1395
00:53:53,109 --> 00:53:49,839
first-hand accounts and when those

1396
00:53:55,990 --> 00:53:53,119
first-hand accounts have been translated

1397
00:53:57,990 --> 00:53:56,000
into english and i am ter i know no

1398
00:54:00,390 --> 00:53:58,000
other languages i i get by in english

1399
00:54:02,470 --> 00:54:00,400
and that's about it um when i don't have

1400
00:54:04,710 --> 00:54:02,480
access to the actual words it makes me

1401
00:54:06,630 --> 00:54:04,720
wonder what i might be missing or what

1402
00:54:10,230 --> 00:54:06,640
the translation might be missing and and

1403
00:54:13,990 --> 00:54:10,240
so that that's always been one of my uh

1404
00:54:15,910 --> 00:54:14,000
one of my my hold ups um

1405
00:54:17,829 --> 00:54:15,920
i'm also

1406
00:54:19,190 --> 00:54:17,839
sometimes concerned about

1407
00:54:21,670 --> 00:54:19,200
uh about

1408
00:54:23,829 --> 00:54:21,680
cases from africa where

1409
00:54:25,430 --> 00:54:23,839
not because it's from africa but um

1410
00:54:27,349 --> 00:54:25,440
cases from africa where the entire

1411
00:54:28,150 --> 00:54:27,359
perspective is from

1412
00:54:31,829 --> 00:54:28,160
the

1413
00:54:34,150 --> 00:54:31,839
white african settler population um

1414
00:54:35,750 --> 00:54:34,160
i i just feel we got into this very

1415
00:54:39,109 --> 00:54:35,760
early on with my episode about about

1416
00:54:40,390 --> 00:54:39,119
elizabeth claire i

1417
00:54:42,870 --> 00:54:40,400
sorting out

1418
00:54:45,030 --> 00:54:42,880
colonialist aspects of that can be kind

1419
00:54:47,510 --> 00:54:45,040
of difficult so when i when i look at

1420
00:54:51,109 --> 00:54:47,520
international cases i i see some i see

1421
00:54:52,390 --> 00:54:51,119
some pitfalls uh that that i i i've

1422
00:54:54,230 --> 00:54:52,400
always been nervous to work my way

1423
00:54:56,230 --> 00:54:54,240
around but uh there will be more

1424
00:54:59,510 --> 00:54:56,240
international cases in the coming year

1425
00:55:01,430 --> 00:54:59,520
um i've got some uh some fun stuff uh on

1426
00:55:03,270 --> 00:55:01,440
um on tap

1427
00:55:04,789 --> 00:55:03,280
oh whatever a couple people said

1428
00:55:06,390 --> 00:55:04,799
whatever you want to talk about whatever

1429
00:55:09,829 --> 00:55:06,400
you bring us i'm going to enjoy

1430
00:55:12,870 --> 00:55:09,839
thank you um richard hoagland oh i hate

1431
00:55:14,390 --> 00:55:12,880
richard hoagland he's so pompous but

1432
00:55:16,870 --> 00:55:14,400
yeah probably richard hoagland at some

1433
00:55:18,630 --> 00:55:16,880
point uh alleged man-made flying saucers

1434
00:55:21,349 --> 00:55:18,640
maybe cover the book intercept but don't

1435
00:55:23,589 --> 00:55:21,359
shoot by renato vesco i've my dad found

1436
00:55:25,829 --> 00:55:23,599
me a copy at an auction and sent that to

1437
00:55:28,230 --> 00:55:25,839
me uh there's a chapter in kiho's flying

1438
00:55:30,230 --> 00:55:28,240
saucers are real uh in which an alleged

1439
00:55:33,829 --> 00:55:30,240
disinformant named john steele great

1440
00:55:35,750 --> 00:55:33,839
name lays out the exact same man-made um

1441
00:55:37,430 --> 00:55:35,760
technology

1442
00:55:39,670 --> 00:55:37,440
or saucer scenario that vesco would more

1443
00:55:41,030 --> 00:55:39,680
than a decade later german technology

1444
00:55:42,789 --> 00:55:41,040
developed by the british post world war

1445
00:55:45,670 --> 00:55:42,799
ii and eventually shared with the united

1446
00:55:49,990 --> 00:55:45,680
states in exchange for atom bomb tech uh

1447
00:55:51,990 --> 00:55:50,000
yeah i think that is um that is a good a

1448
00:55:53,990 --> 00:55:52,000
good angle there's a couple people

1449
00:55:55,990 --> 00:55:54,000
asking for secret space program stuff

1450
00:55:57,430 --> 00:55:56,000
which which sort of ties into that in

1451
00:55:58,549 --> 00:55:57,440
some ways

1452
00:56:00,390 --> 00:55:58,559
um

1453
00:56:02,390 --> 00:56:00,400
more canadian incidents falcon lake is

1454
00:56:04,870 --> 00:56:02,400
an example yes uh shag harbor i need to

1455
00:56:07,750 --> 00:56:04,880
do a shag harper incident bill moore's

1456
00:56:09,430 --> 00:56:07,760
89 mufon speech sooner rather than later

1457
00:56:10,390 --> 00:56:09,440
you'll have it before the end of the

1458
00:56:12,470 --> 00:56:10,400
year

1459
00:56:14,390 --> 00:56:12,480
um maybe something about joseph farrell

1460
00:56:16,069 --> 00:56:14,400
or one of his books i used to think he

1461
00:56:17,670 --> 00:56:16,079
was hot but he's full of it not

1462
00:56:19,190 --> 00:56:17,680
quite as gullible as timothy good but he

1463
00:56:20,549 --> 00:56:19,200
certainly believes every story which he

1464
00:56:23,030 --> 00:56:20,559
perceives as validation of his

1465
00:56:25,349 --> 00:56:23,040
pro-catholic pro-putin pro-supernazis

1466
00:56:27,589 --> 00:56:25,359
world view yeah farrell is an

1467
00:56:30,390 --> 00:56:27,599
interesting cat uh i read some of his

1468
00:56:32,150 --> 00:56:30,400
stuff for my first book on conspiracy

1469
00:56:34,549 --> 00:56:32,160
theories but not much

1470
00:56:35,510 --> 00:56:34,559
not much beyond that

1471
00:56:37,829 --> 00:56:35,520
um

1472
00:56:39,670 --> 00:56:37,839
please outline the history of apro

1473
00:56:41,829 --> 00:56:39,680
sometime did it die with the lorenzens

1474
00:56:43,829 --> 00:56:41,839
why did no else when else can continue

1475
00:56:46,630 --> 00:56:43,839
it for that matter why is mufan a big

1476
00:56:48,470 --> 00:56:46,640
deal in popular culture and kufos isn't

1477
00:56:51,589 --> 00:56:48,480
um oh i forgot to mention this one's

1478
00:56:53,109 --> 00:56:51,599
from uh longtime listener lester um

1479
00:56:54,789 --> 00:56:53,119
i uh

1480
00:56:57,030 --> 00:56:54,799
yeah apro we're definitely gonna do an

1481
00:56:58,470 --> 00:56:57,040
apro episode maybe an episode on ufo

1482
00:57:00,789 --> 00:56:58,480
organizations

1483
00:57:02,870 --> 00:57:00,799
in general because those are all

1484
00:57:04,150 --> 00:57:02,880
good questions

1485
00:57:05,750 --> 00:57:04,160
i would like to see more episodes

1486
00:57:07,750 --> 00:57:05,760
devoted to the impact of ufos and

1487
00:57:09,190 --> 00:57:07,760
popular culture especially classic tv

1488
00:57:11,589 --> 00:57:09,200
shows like the invaders and the british

1489
00:57:14,230 --> 00:57:11,599
show ufo yep that is

1490
00:57:16,309 --> 00:57:14,240
on uh absolutely on my radar

1491
00:57:17,910 --> 00:57:16,319
uh back i enjoy background stories about

1492
00:57:19,829 --> 00:57:17,920
the people in ufology like the episode

1493
00:57:21,190 --> 00:57:19,839
you did about the millabs debacle i want

1494
00:57:23,349 --> 00:57:21,200
more tea spilled on these characters

1495
00:57:24,630 --> 00:57:23,359
please like maybe the oh 89 mufon

1496
00:57:28,069 --> 00:57:24,640
conference

1497
00:57:31,030 --> 00:57:28,079
yes yes uh more zines uh more

1498
00:57:33,430 --> 00:57:31,040
periodicals more digging into some old

1499
00:57:34,950 --> 00:57:33,440
ufo blogs ooh

1500
00:57:39,270 --> 00:57:34,960
that might be interesting the ufo

1501
00:57:41,190 --> 00:57:39,280
blogging scene about 10 15 years ago was

1502
00:57:43,910 --> 00:57:41,200
one of the things that got me back into

1503
00:57:46,230 --> 00:57:43,920
ufos wilbert smith

1504
00:57:47,910 --> 00:57:46,240
scientist to contact e

1505
00:57:49,670 --> 00:57:47,920
yeah

1506
00:57:51,430 --> 00:57:49,680
i like that one on twitter you joke that

1507
00:57:53,670 --> 00:57:51,440
you're going to do an episode about 19th

1508
00:57:56,069 --> 00:57:53,680
century intentional communities are you

1509
00:57:59,589 --> 00:57:56,079
or any other kind of non-ufo history

1510
00:58:01,829 --> 00:57:59,599
topic uh i've thought about that um

1511
00:58:03,510 --> 00:58:01,839
i thought it might be an interesting uh

1512
00:58:04,549 --> 00:58:03,520
interesting april fool's joke for you to

1513
00:58:06,829 --> 00:58:04,559
get to the end of the episode and

1514
00:58:08,870 --> 00:58:06,839
realize there had been no ufos in it

1515
00:58:10,789 --> 00:58:08,880
whatsoever um

1516
00:58:12,230 --> 00:58:10,799
it might be fun kind of giving it away

1517
00:58:13,589 --> 00:58:12,240
now but it's a long time to liberal

1518
00:58:15,030 --> 00:58:13,599
you'll forget

1519
00:58:16,309 --> 00:58:15,040
some late 20th century sightings and

1520
00:58:18,710 --> 00:58:16,319
scammers such as the gulf breeze

1521
00:58:20,950 --> 00:58:18,720
sightings hey there we go

1522
00:58:23,270 --> 00:58:20,960
coming up next contactees in

1523
00:58:25,109 --> 00:58:23,280
afrofuturism yes i've got a lot of

1524
00:58:27,510 --> 00:58:25,119
background reading to do but

1525
00:58:31,829 --> 00:58:27,520
afrofuturism and its connection to some

1526
00:58:34,470 --> 00:58:31,839
contactees is definitely on my list

1527
00:58:35,829 --> 00:58:34,480
doris lessing's canopus and argos series

1528
00:58:37,510 --> 00:58:35,839
if you have the years it would take to

1529
00:58:39,109 --> 00:58:37,520
slog through the whole thing this is

1530
00:58:40,950 --> 00:58:39,119
elaborate science fiction that reads

1531
00:58:43,030 --> 00:58:40,960
like a contact e story full of ancient

1532
00:58:45,030 --> 00:58:43,040
aliens and conspiracies which you can

1533
00:58:47,430 --> 00:58:45,040
compare to tony rodriguez's series

1534
00:58:49,349 --> 00:58:47,440
colony cavalier a true account of one

1535
00:58:52,230 --> 00:58:49,359
man's 20-year abduction

1536
00:58:53,109 --> 00:58:52,240
um lessing as a nobel prize winner tony

1537
00:58:56,470 --> 00:58:53,119
is not

1538
00:58:57,990 --> 00:58:56,480
bob renaud um so also i'd also be

1539
00:59:00,390 --> 00:58:58,000
interested to see if you do anything on

1540
00:59:02,069 --> 00:59:00,400
any of the bigger or smaller

1541
00:59:04,230 --> 00:59:02,079
alien abduction stories of the 70s and

1542
00:59:07,030 --> 00:59:04,240
80s i bet you'd do a great one on the

1543
00:59:09,190 --> 00:59:07,040
mit abduction conference yeah mit

1544
00:59:11,829 --> 00:59:09,200
abduction conference is

1545
00:59:14,549 --> 00:59:11,839
if i do just an abduction phenomenon

1546
00:59:17,030 --> 00:59:14,559
episode um people have requested bud

1547
00:59:19,750 --> 00:59:17,040
hopkins and john mack here i i think

1548
00:59:23,030 --> 00:59:19,760
looking at that conference is probably a

1549
00:59:26,150 --> 00:59:23,040
good way to do this uh more contacty

1550
00:59:28,150 --> 00:59:26,160
mythology uh failed prophecies it seems

1551
00:59:29,829 --> 00:59:28,160
like contact he's really given bad intel

1552
00:59:31,589 --> 00:59:29,839
in the 90s it seemed like art bell

1553
00:59:35,190 --> 00:59:31,599
reported about ford disclosure or

1554
00:59:36,470 --> 00:59:35,200
landing events a year yes he did um and

1555
00:59:38,950 --> 00:59:36,480
i've got a couple of those failed

1556
00:59:42,309 --> 00:59:38,960
prophecy type things that i would like

1557
00:59:45,510 --> 00:59:42,319
to dig into uh probably the biggest one

1558
00:59:48,069 --> 00:59:45,520
is the um is hale bop

1559
00:59:50,390 --> 00:59:48,079
not heaven's gate necessarily although

1560
00:59:53,349 --> 00:59:50,400
that would be a good topic but the hail

1561
00:59:55,670 --> 00:59:53,359
bop comet companion courtney brown

1562
00:59:58,230 --> 00:59:55,680
remote viewing things ed dames remote

1563
01:00:00,630 --> 00:59:58,240
viewing things art bell and whitley

1564
01:00:02,950 --> 01:00:00,640
strieber promoting it and then very very

1565
01:00:04,789 --> 01:00:02,960
quickly um sort of pivoting art bell

1566
01:00:06,710 --> 01:00:04,799
especially pivoting back and forth from

1567
01:00:08,710 --> 01:00:06,720
i'm a journalist and i broke the news to

1568
01:00:10,390 --> 01:00:08,720
i'm an entertainer i didn't

1569
01:00:13,109 --> 01:00:10,400
mean any nothing you hear on my show you

1570
01:00:14,390 --> 01:00:13,119
can take seriously um yeah courtney

1571
01:00:15,990 --> 01:00:14,400
brown and hellbop

1572
01:00:24,069 --> 01:00:16,000
um

1573
01:00:26,470 --> 01:00:24,079
a big spot in my heart for

1574
01:00:28,789 --> 01:00:26,480
all the earth changes prediction people

1575
01:00:30,630 --> 01:00:28,799
back in the 90s gordon michael scallion

1576
01:00:33,589 --> 01:00:30,640
and and things like that and there is a

1577
01:00:34,470 --> 01:00:33,599
bit of that coming with the gulf breeze

1578
01:00:35,750 --> 01:00:34,480
six

1579
01:00:39,430 --> 01:00:35,760
to a degree

1580
01:00:41,510 --> 01:00:39,440
and uh last topic um phil class i love

1581
01:00:43,910 --> 01:00:41,520
how ufo buffs hate him

1582
01:00:44,710 --> 01:00:43,920
yes and i was thinking a double header

1583
01:00:47,829 --> 01:00:44,720
on

1584
01:00:49,829 --> 01:00:47,839
uber skeptic phil class and earlier

1585
01:00:53,990 --> 01:00:49,839
an earlier generation's uber skeptic

1586
01:01:02,309 --> 01:00:54,000
donald menzel would be a fun sort of

1587
01:01:07,990 --> 01:01:04,390
thanks for listening today and for the

1588
01:01:10,390 --> 01:01:08,000
last five years come back next time for

1589
01:01:12,150 --> 01:01:10,400
the gulf breeze ufo sightings

1590
01:01:14,470 --> 01:01:12,160
our associate producer is as always

1591
01:01:16,950 --> 01:01:14,480
simpson j hanover iii saucer life is a

1592
01:01:19,430 --> 01:01:16,960
production of chizo media llc chiso

1593
01:01:21,670 --> 01:01:19,440
media our heart is with the people till

1594
01:01:24,270 --> 01:01:21,680
next time keep watching the skies

1595
01:01:31,080 --> 01:01:24,280
because the skies are watching you

1596
01:01:36,230 --> 01:01:34,069
[Music]

1597
01:01:39,190 --> 01:01:36,240
we live our entire lives knowing that

1598
01:01:41,030 --> 01:01:39,200
death awaits us many believe that some

1599
01:01:43,430 --> 01:01:41,040
part of us endures

1600
01:01:45,589 --> 01:01:43,440
eyewitnesses swear to have seen spirits

1601
01:01:47,430 --> 01:01:45,599
of the dead haunting the living

1602
01:01:48,870 --> 01:01:47,440
and even appearing during alien

1603
01:01:50,950 --> 01:01:48,880
abductions

1604
01:01:52,789 --> 01:01:50,960
is the ufo mystery reaching out to us

1605
01:01:55,349 --> 01:01:52,799
from beyond the stars

1606
01:01:57,510 --> 01:01:55,359
or from beyond the grave

1607
01:01:59,990 --> 01:01:57,520
this staggering implication demands not

1608
01:02:02,870 --> 01:02:00,000
only scrutiny of the ufo phenomenon but

1609
01:02:06,630 --> 01:02:02,880
near-death experiences ancient monuments

1610
01:02:09,029 --> 01:02:06,640
ley lines the faithful cryptids and more

1611
01:02:11,510 --> 01:02:09,039
i'm joshua cutchen i'd like to invite

1612
01:02:14,069 --> 01:02:11,520
you into the ecology of souls a new

1613
01:02:15,990 --> 01:02:14,079
mythology of death in the paranormal

1614
01:02:17,990 --> 01:02:16,000
a comprehensive theory of all things

1615
01:02:19,990 --> 01:02:18,000
supernatural framed through the lens of

1616
01:02:22,069 --> 01:02:20,000
our final transition

1617
01:02:24,870 --> 01:02:22,079
join me as we journey from the depths of

1618
01:02:27,510 --> 01:02:24,880
prehistory to the present from the outer

1619
01:02:28,789 --> 01:02:27,520
space of the cosmos to the inner space

1620
01:02:31,910 --> 01:02:28,799
of the self

1621
01:02:34,549 --> 01:02:31,920
ecology of souls volumes one and two now

1622
01:02:36,309 --> 01:02:34,559
available from amazon in print and as a

1623
01:02:44,390 --> 01:02:36,319
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1624
01:02:50,470 --> 01:02:48,710
are you fascinated by ufos the occult

1625
01:02:53,109 --> 01:02:50,480
strange history

1626
01:02:56,549 --> 01:02:53,119
and more

1627
01:02:59,029 --> 01:02:56,559
on october 14th through the 16th at sir

1628
01:03:02,309 --> 01:02:59,039
nashville the strange realities

1629
01:03:04,390 --> 01:03:02,319
conference 2022 will take place three

1630
01:03:08,870 --> 01:03:04,400
days of exploring the mysteries of the

1631
01:03:11,670 --> 01:03:08,880
supernatural history ufos the occult and

1632
01:03:15,750 --> 01:03:11,680
much much more featuring presentations

1633
01:03:18,390 --> 01:03:15,760
by steve berg micah hanks john tinney

1634
01:03:21,670 --> 01:03:18,400
adam go rightly tim bernal christopher

1635
01:03:24,950 --> 01:03:21,680
ernst samantha engel recluse nathan

1636
01:03:26,630 --> 01:03:24,960
isaac melody blackthorne dr future

1637
01:03:29,510 --> 01:03:26,640
sariah asgath

1638
01:03:32,710 --> 01:03:29,520
timothy renner aaron gulias delaney

1639
01:03:36,150 --> 01:03:32,720
bowers olaf phillips and david metcalfe

1640
01:03:38,630 --> 01:03:36,160
with workshops by kiki dombrowski ren

1641
01:03:42,309 --> 01:03:38,640
collier and michael hughes

1642
01:03:43,990 --> 01:03:42,319
come join us and nashville are online

1643
01:03:46,870 --> 01:03:44,000
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1644
01:03:47,990 --> 01:03:46,880
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1645
01:03:50,820 --> 01:03:48,000
find out